[Thyrllan]

I'm re-reading looking for things to resolve my mind on this situation - I have to go home right now though. It will be 13 or 14 hours before I can come back probably. Who ever is left for town, do some hard looking
See who has no interaction w/ Anthras - some times that is helpful


Stupid time constraints

[Karatallid]

Well, I'm back home finally. And it feels like I've started another game of mafia. wb GL. Been awhile. I was doing a quick reread earlier and I too saw the initial burst of energy throughout Day 1, somewhat into Day 2, and then you just vanish as RL swallows you whole. And now you are back for the end game. I think the general gestalt actually makes sense, but I will need to examine the posts more closely.

The other pattern I noticed with the third and final suspect of our trio, Atrahal, is the beginning of the day sprees. Atrahal, from what I what I saw, basically popped on at the beginning of the day, made some larger posts and then melted into the background till the next day. This behavior alone warrants a closer look.

Really of the three of you, Thyr, GL, and Atrahal, only GL's play style is inconsistent almost to the point of believability. Thyr and Atrahal both hide in their own ways, adding content without really getting involved, and surviving all the way to the end.

So I am happy to also review my own game play. Other than jibes here and there, no one has looked into me and I was beginning to wonder if I was PI along with Korabas.

[Karatallid]

Thyrllan, on 08 March 2012 - 11:30 PM, said:

Karatallid, on 01 March 2012 - 11:20 AM, said:

Damn Korabas. Shitty to lose that town secret advantage (of course it does make sense to reveal because being lovers provides no advantage if one of the two of you are dead).

However, if we have paired killers (or even a symp who knows his master), this is a perfect opportunity to try to CI one's self and partner/master. I will need more thought on this before I give you more credibility than anyone else.

first mention of paired killers this game - he who smelt it dealt it

Yeah, definitely one of the more popular means of hunting scum. I did actually see this work in one game, but that might have been just luck. However, you haven't really captured the essence of the idea. The larger concept is people with a role can't stop speculating about their role. They want to talk about it as if they have no idea how it works (same for various town roles and again, have seen this play out in other games, so it can be valid reasoning imho).

So look at the red below, and tell me, does GL sound like scum speculating on his role?

Galayn Lord, on 01 March 2012 - 02:56 PM, said:

Alkend, on 01 March 2012 - 02:48 PM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 01 March 2012 - 02:44 PM, said:

Alkend, on 01 March 2012 - 02:38 PM, said:

Tiamatha, on 01 March 2012 - 02:20 PM, said:

I took my vote away so that scum could not hammer without us discussing it first



so what do you make of it?

Right now I feel like this "reveal" is pretty damned convenient. Korabas really hasn't had much to say until now. I think we have about as likely a case as we are going to have on day 1 for a lynch, and then as soon as it gets down to the wire, they are supposedly lovers. If you are going to reveal as lovers, why not give us some proof that you are communicating offline? If they are lovers, it would be an odd twist that they would both be killers in such a small group, but I suppose its not impossible.

What do you mean? Paired killers can almost always talk off-thread...

I mean I think that it would be odd for them to give us paired killers in this small of a group.

I disagree, with 13 players we could easily have paired killers and a symp, especially since the OP mentions possible town roles and potential twist in mechanics.

Actually right now I think the reveal is really, really bad and we should test it.

Let's lynch Korabas and if he's town, that will VPI Okaros (though Korabas could be symping him, it still leaves us with more and better options); if he's a killer then we have struck gold. Statistically we are probably going to end up lynching a townie on day one no matter how good our cases are, but I think that this vote will at the very least eliminate a lot of bad possibilities that will haunt us down the road.

Vote Korabas

Galayn Lord, on 01 March 2012 - 04:29 PM, said:

So are we kind of assuming 3 scum? I think that number makes sense, and the most obvious options are paired killers and a symp, or two symps and a killer. Symps probably wouldn't know each other, that would be unbalanced and make things pretty complicated in this situation. If Okaros is being symped by Korabas then he's just now realizing it and going along with the lover reveal. So in that context, lynching Okaros still makes sense. What I was really interested in was how he was going to respond to the reveal. He disdains it pretty strongly which makes me suspicious that it may not be true.

We need to hear more from Korabas too. If he doesn't show up and start explaining more then I think we should stick with Okaros. Reveal to save lynch target + prolonged absence = scummy, so we can lynch Okaros and see if they were lying or not. If Okaros is town, he's either lying to save himself even though he's not Korabas's lover (unlikely, but hey, it's a noob game and maybe he just doesn't want to die - and if this is true, Okaros, please just fess up because lying hurts town more than almost anything else), or he was really a lover. I guess the symp possibility still exists, but I doubt that any scum would know a symp's alt, so that doesn't make sense.

Regardless, the role is blown, which sucks.

edit - first sentence, added we - "...are WE kind..."

edit - also added (...if this is true Okaros...)

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 5. 12 hours and 9 minutes remaining
5 Players still alive: Atrahal, Galayn Lord, Karatallid, Korabas, Thyrllan

3 votes to lynch, 3 votes to go to night.


Players not voted: Atrahal, Galayn Lord, Karatallid, Korabas, Thyrllan

[Karatallid]

Thyrllan, on 08 March 2012 - 11:37 PM, said:

I'm re-reading looking for things to resolve my mind on this situation - I have to go home right now though. It will be 13 or 14 hours before I can come back probably. Who ever is left for town, do some hard looking
See who has no interaction w/ Anthras - some times that is helpful


Stupid time constraints

Why do we have to do all the work? You barely even stayed to hear my rebuttal!

Also, in referring to town as a separate entity instead of saying "Who ever is left on my side, do some hard looking" or "We need to do some hard looking," you Thyr give us an example of yet another slippery subtly: referring to town as a separate team, implying you are not on that team.

Again, seen this work beautifully in one game. A scum player slipped up, tried to scramble and say his accusers were WIFOMing him to death, and turns out, whaddya know, he was scum who forgot that he was supposed to pretend to be part of town. Oops.

And for those that will accuse me of WIFOM, I will point back (and even quote should you wish) my prior case on Thyr. Thyr just has so many scummy traits and actions, I am just incredulous that he is still with us.

[Atrahal]

If we think Thyr is scummy, we should lynch him. My only worry is that he is possibly a symp...but given the number of cf'd innos that have been lynched or NK'd, I think this is unlikely.

[Atrahal]

Galayn Lord, on 08 March 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Thyrllan, on 08 March 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

Everybody's been calling me scummy the whole time. Hasn't stopped me from playing the same way or saying what I want.



Kara - has had no heat, no cases against him, smooth sailer - I suspected him from the start, but my gut has been a lying beast this game (at least looking for a killer)

Yeah....that's the mark of a good scum. Doesn't buckle under pressure, sticks to his guns, uses it as proof that he's inno. Doesn't clear you.

Kara is still a main suspect. In fact right now I have to say my top two choices are Thyr and Kara; Atrahal isn't giving me scum vibes and I haven't gotten to a full reread yet anyway.

But if you are town, hold your vote for awhile. Seriously. If we have two scum alive, they will jump on a town lynch and hammer the fuck out of us and end the game if someone votes wrong. Be. Very. Careful.

I want to vote before I have to leave, but this is what I'm worried about.

[Galayn Lord]

Well we have like 12 hours left right? So that should be enough time for everyone to return in time and get a vote in. I won't be able to do my continually prophesied reread and massive thought-post until about 5 or 6 hours from now. So if you are town, it is better not to vote and try to make it before the deadline, set your alarm, THIS IS MAFIA BITCHES GEAR UP FOR D-DAY IT'S GO TIME. And vote then. Because one bad vote can end the game for us.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 5. 11 hours and 36 minutes remaining
5 Players still alive: Atrahal, Galayn Lord, Karatallid, Korabas, Thyrllan

3 votes to lynch, 3 votes to go to night.


Players not voted: Atrahal, Galayn Lord, Karatallid, Korabas, Thyrllan

[Karatallid]

Atrahal, on 09 March 2012 - 12:22 AM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 08 March 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Thyrllan, on 08 March 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

Everybody's been calling me scummy the whole time. Hasn't stopped me from playing the same way or saying what I want.



Kara - has had no heat, no cases against him, smooth sailer - I suspected him from the start, but my gut has been a lying beast this game (at least looking for a killer)

Yeah....that's the mark of a good scum. Doesn't buckle under pressure, sticks to his guns, uses it as proof that he's inno. Doesn't clear you.

Kara is still a main suspect. In fact right now I have to say my top two choices are Thyr and Kara; Atrahal isn't giving me scum vibes and I haven't gotten to a full reread yet anyway.

But if you are town, hold your vote for awhile. Seriously. If we have two scum alive, they will jump on a town lynch and hammer the fuck out of us and end the game if someone votes wrong. Be. Very. Careful.

I want to vote before I have to leave, but this is what I'm worried about.

How long till you leave Atrahal?

And why are we wait 5-6 hours for you GL? Start talking (you did a great job of it on Day 1). I mean, are you waiting till the last minute for a speed lynch or something?

I agree that there is merit in waiting to discuss things, but I'm not so sure you are worth the wait, and who will be around when you've finally finished your detailed analysis? Didn't you have some analysis done from yesterday or was that all a ruse too?

[Galayn Lord]

Karatallid, on 09 March 2012 - 01:04 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 09 March 2012 - 12:22 AM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 08 March 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Thyrllan, on 08 March 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

Everybody's been calling me scummy the whole time. Hasn't stopped me from playing the same way or saying what I want.



Kara - has had no heat, no cases against him, smooth sailer - I suspected him from the start, but my gut has been a lying beast this game (at least looking for a killer)

Yeah....that's the mark of a good scum. Doesn't buckle under pressure, sticks to his guns, uses it as proof that he's inno. Doesn't clear you.

Kara is still a main suspect. In fact right now I have to say my top two choices are Thyr and Kara; Atrahal isn't giving me scum vibes and I haven't gotten to a full reread yet anyway.

But if you are town, hold your vote for awhile. Seriously. If we have two scum alive, they will jump on a town lynch and hammer the fuck out of us and end the game if someone votes wrong. Be. Very. Careful.

I want to vote before I have to leave, but this is what I'm worried about.

How long till you leave Atrahal?

And why are we wait 5-6 hours for you GL? Start talking (you did a great job of it on Day 1). I mean, are you waiting till the last minute for a speed lynch or something?

I agree that there is merit in waiting to discuss things, but I'm not so sure you are worth the wait, and who will be around when you've finally finished your detailed analysis? Didn't you have some analysis done from yesterday or was that all a ruse too?

Oh, I'm not saying everyone HAS to wait, only that I physically will not be able to sit down at the computer and do this write up on the whole game until then. So since we have about double that time left I thought it was a decent suggestion if town really is going to try to win this thing.

[Galayn Lord]

Oh, as for yesterday, I came on to do my "analysis" and we had lynched scum, so I tabled it until tomorrow (which is today). RL has been fucking me, if my wife knew I was posting instead of working she would not be happy right now.

[Karatallid]

Fair enough, but whether your wife is happy with you or not is irrelevant to whether or not you are scum. I mean, what gets me is that you took the opportunity of a lynch before you returned to procrastinate on making a case, even giving some solid thoughts. I actually think on day 1 it's a little easier to look insightful because people are still getting a feel for each other. And you definitely were feeling up many people all at once, even voting for Korabas out of the blue instead of Okaros, despite your suspicions of a killer pair. I mean, if they are both scum, why does it matter who you vote for?

I dunno GL. I sympathize with business and I also sympathize with playing the game despite not really having the time for it. But don't BS us.

[Karatallid]

Galayn Lord, on 09 March 2012 - 01:11 AM, said:

Karatallid, on 09 March 2012 - 01:04 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 09 March 2012 - 12:22 AM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 08 March 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Thyrllan, on 08 March 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

Everybody's been calling me scummy the whole time. Hasn't stopped me from playing the same way or saying what I want.



Kara - has had no heat, no cases against him, smooth sailer - I suspected him from the start, but my gut has been a lying beast this game (at least looking for a killer)

Yeah....that's the mark of a good scum. Doesn't buckle under pressure, sticks to his guns, uses it as proof that he's inno. Doesn't clear you.

Kara is still a main suspect. In fact right now I have to say my top two choices are Thyr and Kara; Atrahal isn't giving me scum vibes and I haven't gotten to a full reread yet anyway.

But if you are town, hold your vote for awhile. Seriously. If we have two scum alive, they will jump on a town lynch and hammer the fuck out of us and end the game if someone votes wrong. Be. Very. Careful.

I want to vote before I have to leave, but this is what I'm worried about.

How long till you leave Atrahal?

And why are we wait 5-6 hours for you GL? Start talking (you did a great job of it on Day 1). I mean, are you waiting till the last minute for a speed lynch or something?

I agree that there is merit in waiting to discuss things, but I'm not so sure you are worth the wait, and who will be around when you've finally finished your detailed analysis? Didn't you have some analysis done from yesterday or was that all a ruse too?

Oh, I'm not saying everyone HAS to wait, only that I physically will not be able to sit down at the computer and do this write up on the whole game until then. So since we have about double that time left I thought it was a decent suggestion if town really is going to try to win this thing.

It does sound like a decent idea, btw; that is if people are around to discuss things. Right now, I'm not sure if Atrahal will return, and Korabas' presence is sporadic at best. Really, I only see you hovering despite being busy, and since Thyr seems present at all times, I am doubtful he will take 13-14 hours to return to us.

So I don't like having two suspects, who are now lining up in the time of their reappearance, disappearing from the thread, not really making cases and instead waiting for others to talk (and vote) before landing a vote themselves.

[Galayn Lord]

Karatallid, on 09 March 2012 - 01:22 AM, said:

Fair enough, but whether your wife is happy with you or not is irrelevant to whether or not you are scum. I mean, what gets me is that you took the opportunity of a lynch before you returned to procrastinate on making a case, even giving some solid thoughts. I actually think on day 1 it's a little easier to look insightful because people are still getting a feel for each other. And you definitely were feeling up many people all at once, even voting for Korabas out of the blue instead of Okaros, despite your suspicions of a killer pair. I mean, if they are both scum, why does it matter who you vote for?

I dunno GL. I sympathize with business and I also sympathize with playing the game despite not really having the time for it. But don't BS us.

I voted Korabas because it made sense to me at the time to test at least one of them, and Korabas had totally disappeared after revealing and Okaros was defending himself vigorously. I didn't like how Korabas played it and so I voted for him.

Also, I am not bullshitting here, I will do my reread and make my best judgment on who is scum. And I'll try to do it sooner rather than later. In fact....well, I may be able to stick around here at work and do it, cause I assume it should take me an a hour, maybe more. If not, it will be a couple more hours till I can.

As for scum, well, I've alluded to it today a bit but I am the special town role. I am the Coroner. If I die, there are no CFs for the rest of the game. The role probably isn't that important anymore because it's D-Day now and I survived this long, and that also means you can't really test it by lynching me because it's D-Day (but if you were town that would be pretty crazy to go along with). If I die, I will CF as the Coroner.

I reveal because we are down to the wire and I want to put myself out there and show some trust. This is also a test, because 3 votes is not that many to lynch, and I think it's impossible for there to be 4 scum in a game this size, which means WCS only 2 left. So they can't lynch me outright. It should also make scum wary of voting for me because it will...well...make them look scummy. If you are town and you don't buy my reveal, wait until I can lay my thoughts out and then you can vote whomever you like and the game will go one way or the other.

[Galayn Lord]

Karatallid, on 09 March 2012 - 01:26 AM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 09 March 2012 - 01:11 AM, said:

Karatallid, on 09 March 2012 - 01:04 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 09 March 2012 - 12:22 AM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 08 March 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Thyrllan, on 08 March 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

Everybody's been calling me scummy the whole time. Hasn't stopped me from playing the same way or saying what I want.



Kara - has had no heat, no cases against him, smooth sailer - I suspected him from the start, but my gut has been a lying beast this game (at least looking for a killer)

Yeah....that's the mark of a good scum. Doesn't buckle under pressure, sticks to his guns, uses it as proof that he's inno. Doesn't clear you.

Kara is still a main suspect. In fact right now I have to say my top two choices are Thyr and Kara; Atrahal isn't giving me scum vibes and I haven't gotten to a full reread yet anyway.

But if you are town, hold your vote for awhile. Seriously. If we have two scum alive, they will jump on a town lynch and hammer the fuck out of us and end the game if someone votes wrong. Be. Very. Careful.

I want to vote before I have to leave, but this is what I'm worried about.

How long till you leave Atrahal?

And why are we wait 5-6 hours for you GL? Start talking (you did a great job of it on Day 1). I mean, are you waiting till the last minute for a speed lynch or something?

I agree that there is merit in waiting to discuss things, but I'm not so sure you are worth the wait, and who will be around when you've finally finished your detailed analysis? Didn't you have some analysis done from yesterday or was that all a ruse too?

Oh, I'm not saying everyone HAS to wait, only that I physically will not be able to sit down at the computer and do this write up on the whole game until then. So since we have about double that time left I thought it was a decent suggestion if town really is going to try to win this thing.

It does sound like a decent idea, btw; that is if people are around to discuss things. Right now, I'm not sure if Atrahal will return, and Korabas' presence is sporadic at best. Really, I only see you hovering despite being busy, and since Thyr seems present at all times, I am doubtful he will take 13-14 hours to return to us.

So I don't like having two suspects, who are now lining up in the time of their reappearance, disappearing from the thread, not really making cases and instead waiting for others to talk (and vote) before landing a vote themselves.

Yes...I agree, the waiting thing makes it hard for people to show up. Hopefully they will, though, and hopefully I can do my part and put my thoughts down sooner rather than later.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 5. 10 hours and 17 minutes remaining
5 Players still alive: Atrahal, Galayn Lord, Karatallid, Korabas, Thyrllan

3 votes to lynch, 3 votes to go to night.


Players not voted: Atrahal, Galayn Lord, Karatallid, Korabas, Thyrllan

I'm off for the night.

-JLV

[Karatallid]

Galayn Lord, on 09 March 2012 - 01:41 AM, said:

Karatallid, on 09 March 2012 - 01:22 AM, said:

Fair enough, but whether your wife is happy with you or not is irrelevant to whether or not you are scum. I mean, what gets me is that you took the opportunity of a lynch before you returned to procrastinate on making a case, even giving some solid thoughts. I actually think on day 1 it's a little easier to look insightful because people are still getting a feel for each other. And you definitely were feeling up many people all at once, even voting for Korabas out of the blue instead of Okaros, despite your suspicions of a killer pair. I mean, if they are both scum, why does it matter who you vote for?

I dunno GL. I sympathize with business and I also sympathize with playing the game despite not really having the time for it. But don't BS us.

I voted Korabas because it made sense to me at the time to test at least one of them, and Korabas had totally disappeared after revealing and Okaros was defending himself vigorously. I didn't like how Korabas played it and so I voted for him.

Also, I am not bullshitting here, I will do my reread and make my best judgment on who is scum. And I'll try to do it sooner rather than later. In fact....well, I may be able to stick around here at work and do it, cause I assume it should take me an a hour, maybe more. If not, it will be a couple more hours till I can.

As for scum, well, I've alluded to it today a bit but I am the special town role. I am the Coroner. If I die, there are no CFs for the rest of the game. The role probably isn't that important anymore because it's D-Day now and I survived this long, and that also means you can't really test it by lynching me because it's D-Day (but if you were town that would be pretty crazy to go along with). If I die, I will CF as the Coroner.

I reveal because we are down to the wire and I want to put myself out there and show some trust. This is also a test, because 3 votes is not that many to lynch, and I think it's impossible for there to be 4 scum in a game this size, which means WCS only 2 left. So they can't lynch me outright. It should also make scum wary of voting for me because it will...well...make them look scummy. If you are town and you don't buy my reveal, wait until I can lay my thoughts out and then you can vote whomever you like and the game will go one way or the other.

That is an unusual enough of a role that I am far less suspicious of you now (probably gullible, but I hey I let Korabas have a PI in my mind and this close to the end, I will need to take some risks).

I'm glad we didn't lynch you earlier That would have been a major bummer, especially with the Anthras lynch.

Well, might as well have a reveal-fest. Unfortunately, I don't have anything that glamorous to offer. I'm RI, which is one reason why I have been so out there arguing and tearing into people's arguments. In a game like this, being RI can actually be a luxury.

But no way to confirm that, so believe what you will.

This all to say that I would hesitate to ask for other reveals. If we miss with this lynch but eliminate a symp (should he/she exist), we still have a 2:1 situation where town gets one more shot. And if a good enough role is still around, I want that in the final three. But hopefully that won't be necessary.

[Galayn Lord]

Back in a couple hours.

[Korabas]

I want to assure you all I will be around for time out, but wont be postimg till then because I had my performance tonight and am beat.