[Tulas Shorn]

Omtose, on 24 January 2012 - 06:54 PM, said:

Tulas Shorn, on 24 January 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:

The whole Eloth - Merrid connection seems to me to be role playing gone awol. But even then not really. I have noticed over the last several months that people just don't know how to react to role playing in a game. The usual reaction is to lynch the player. Which while moving the game forward, kind of ruins a big part of what mafia should be. The paranoia which people seem to view RPing which is only as a way for scum to code or to communicate seems to be way over board. Because lets face it. GH who has been scum for the past 3 games has not bothered to code or to try to signal at all. True those have been M/p games, however the function of coding or signaling should be more powerful in those games in then in a merc game. But perhaps I am missing something.

Now I am not saying nor trying to defend either Eloth - Merrid I am just saying that people have begun to try to treat day 1 like it is in the same paranoia level as d-day when day 1 is not even in the hemisphere.

I apologize if this post seems a little like how to play mafia. But it is starting to get tiring to keep reading people asking if someone has to post like that due to a role or some other bullshit. Yes people there are roles like that but come on. Either they are announced at the beginning of the game (benses) or you are playing in a high TMDI (7+) where the moderator is trying out different ideas. If you are playing in a tradition merc game that is the next in a sequence then it is probably ok to assume that this game is moderately harder then the previous game in the cycle. Thus if this was shin's game 5 you could assume that there would be more unusual roles. But since this is only game 2, and shin said that it would only be a marginally higher tmdi then the first one. Which since this is a faction game I took to be that we would be playing in a faction game rather then a straight up town/scum game. So could we dispense with the thoughts that if someone is posting weird then that they are doing that because of a role and assume that they are doing that for their own amusement. Feel free to ignore them if you find that posting irritating.

While I see your point to a certain extent and the earlier things can be dismissed as RPing, a couple of pages later, when it is no longer occuring and something is repeated (the Korean) that could be looked at as an anomaly in the first place, it is strange and worth noting, maybe not worth voting on though. However, what is more concerning is the general way that Eloth has reacted to a small amount of scrutiny and what it could possibly mean, it is silly to ignore such a thing completely.

I do agree that it probably had less to do with roles though and strange mechanics and more to do with play style.

Yes but a couple of pages later is when people came back to the thread or when they first got on the thread. So even if earlier people (me/osseric/kara) had stopped our role playing. It is still day one and thus if someone wants to start out with a little Rping (even if other people have stopped) they should not be scrutinized more closely then the first people who were rping and stopped. The only end to possible rping other then a persons wish to stop should be the end of day 1.

Now the reaction to accusations should be taken into account because that is different the Rping. Once again I am not trying to defend anyone but just trying to increase the amount of RPing that should be allowed to occur on the day 1 of a game.

[Okaros]

Tulas Shorn, on 24 January 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:

The whole Eloth - Merrid connection seems to me to be role playing gone awol. But even then not really. I have noticed over the last several months that people just don't know how to react to role playing in a game. The usual reaction is to lynch the player. Which while moving the game forward, kind of ruins a big part of what mafia should be. The paranoia which people seem to view RPing which is only as a way for scum to code or to communicate seems to be way over board. Because lets face it. GH who has been scum for the past 3 games has not bothered to code or to try to signal at all. True those have been M/p games, however the function of coding or signaling should be more powerful in those games in then in a merc game. But perhaps I am missing something.

Now I am not saying nor trying to defend either Eloth - Merrid I am just saying that people have begun to try to treat day 1 like it is in the same paranoia level as d-day when day 1 is not even in the hemisphere.

I apologize if this post seems a little like how to play mafia. But it is starting to get tiring to keep reading people asking if someone has to post like that due to a role or some other bullshit. Yes people there are roles like that but come on. Either they are announced at the beginning of the game (benses) or you are playing in a high TMDI (7+) where the moderator is trying out different ideas. If you are playing in a tradition merc game that is the next in a sequence then it is probably ok to assume that this game is moderately harder then the previous game in the cycle. Thus if this was shin's game 5 you could assume that there would be more unusual roles. But since this is only game 2, and shin said that it would only be a marginally higher tmdi then the first one. Which since this is a faction game I took to be that we would be playing in a faction game rather then a straight up town/scum game. So could we dispense with the thoughts that if someone is posting weird then that they are doing that because of a role and assume that they are doing that for their own amusement. Feel free to ignore them if you find that posting irritating.

The amusing this is that we're not attacking Eloth for RP. We're attacking Eloth for what seems like a possible signaling and for being exceptionally uncooperative.

As Shelly said; if this had been about RP you would have been on the block and not Eloth.

Although I appreciate your attempt to find something to argue about to participate and all, I feel I must point out that it's wrong.

When that is said, RP never was widely accepted in our games. This mythical past where all was frolicking amongst fields of RP and flowers did in fact never exist.

[Merrid]

I'm fine with RPing. I'm not fine with going overboard with text translated to Japanese, paragraphs written in tiny font, etc. That's not RP it's just annoying. Overall though I don't think the RP is as much the problem as that people are waaaaaay too fixated on this idea of day 1 signaling, something which rarely actually happens and 99% of the time isn't even seen by the signal target when it is done on purpose. To these people EVERYTHING looks like a signal and then there's defense against terrible cases and it all boils over rather quickly, and if you try to keep RPing just a bit you get accused of being non-chalant.

Here's the thing. RP'ing does not have to be big expository paragraphs. It's just a bit of variation in how you talk on-thread. In a game like this you could talk very proper and dignified, addressing everyone with lofty titles and bowing a bunch.

[Omtose]

Tulas Shorn, on 24 January 2012 - 07:05 PM, said:

Omtose, on 24 January 2012 - 06:54 PM, said:

Tulas Shorn, on 24 January 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:

The whole Eloth - Merrid connection seems to me to be role playing gone awol. But even then not really. I have noticed over the last several months that people just don't know how to react to role playing in a game. The usual reaction is to lynch the player. Which while moving the game forward, kind of ruins a big part of what mafia should be. The paranoia which people seem to view RPing which is only as a way for scum to code or to communicate seems to be way over board. Because lets face it. GH who has been scum for the past 3 games has not bothered to code or to try to signal at all. True those have been M/p games, however the function of coding or signaling should be more powerful in those games in then in a merc game. But perhaps I am missing something.

Now I am not saying nor trying to defend either Eloth - Merrid I am just saying that people have begun to try to treat day 1 like it is in the same paranoia level as d-day when day 1 is not even in the hemisphere.

I apologize if this post seems a little like how to play mafia. But it is starting to get tiring to keep reading people asking if someone has to post like that due to a role or some other bullshit. Yes people there are roles like that but come on. Either they are announced at the beginning of the game (benses) or you are playing in a high TMDI (7+) where the moderator is trying out different ideas. If you are playing in a tradition merc game that is the next in a sequence then it is probably ok to assume that this game is moderately harder then the previous game in the cycle. Thus if this was shin's game 5 you could assume that there would be more unusual roles. But since this is only game 2, and shin said that it would only be a marginally higher tmdi then the first one. Which since this is a faction game I took to be that we would be playing in a faction game rather then a straight up town/scum game. So could we dispense with the thoughts that if someone is posting weird then that they are doing that because of a role and assume that they are doing that for their own amusement. Feel free to ignore them if you find that posting irritating.

While I see your point to a certain extent and the earlier things can be dismissed as RPing, a couple of pages later, when it is no longer occuring and something is repeated (the Korean) that could be looked at as an anomaly in the first place, it is strange and worth noting, maybe not worth voting on though. However, what is more concerning is the general way that Eloth has reacted to a small amount of scrutiny and what it could possibly mean, it is silly to ignore such a thing completely.

I do agree that it probably had less to do with roles though and strange mechanics and more to do with play style.

Yes but a couple of pages later is when people came back to the thread or when they first got on the thread. So even if earlier people (me/osseric/kara) had stopped our role playing. It is still day one and thus if someone wants to start out with a little Rping (even if other people have stopped) they should not be scrutinized more closely then the first people who were rping and stopped. The only end to possible rping other then a persons wish to stop should be the end of day 1.

Now the reaction to accusations should be taken into account because that is different the Rping. Once again I am not trying to defend anyone but just trying to increase the amount of RPing that should be allowed to occur on the day 1 of a game.

I don't see RPing as the problem here, I get it and how it could add something extra to the games and i've not felt a great amount of suspicion (well nothing out of the ordinary for mafia) towards those who were doing it. The concern is the reaction that it elicited out of Eloth and the reason we got such a reaction out of him was by noticing something that looked out of place. He has not been at all helpful, the way he has acted is highly irrational and it is natural for people to ask why day 1 or not.

[Tulas Shorn]

Okaros, on 24 January 2012 - 07:07 PM, said:

Tulas Shorn, on 24 January 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:

The whole Eloth - Merrid connection seems to me to be role playing gone awol. But even then not really. I have noticed over the last several months that people just don't know how to react to role playing in a game. The usual reaction is to lynch the player. Which while moving the game forward, kind of ruins a big part of what mafia should be. The paranoia which people seem to view RPing which is only as a way for scum to code or to communicate seems to be way over board. Because lets face it. GH who has been scum for the past 3 games has not bothered to code or to try to signal at all. True those have been M/p games, however the function of coding or signaling should be more powerful in those games in then in a merc game. But perhaps I am missing something.

Now I am not saying nor trying to defend either Eloth - Merrid I am just saying that people have begun to try to treat day 1 like it is in the same paranoia level as d-day when day 1 is not even in the hemisphere.

I apologize if this post seems a little like how to play mafia. But it is starting to get tiring to keep reading people asking if someone has to post like that due to a role or some other bullshit. Yes people there are roles like that but come on. Either they are announced at the beginning of the game (benses) or you are playing in a high TMDI (7+) where the moderator is trying out different ideas. If you are playing in a tradition merc game that is the next in a sequence then it is probably ok to assume that this game is moderately harder then the previous game in the cycle. Thus if this was shin's game 5 you could assume that there would be more unusual roles. But since this is only game 2, and shin said that it would only be a marginally higher tmdi then the first one. Which since this is a faction game I took to be that we would be playing in a faction game rather then a straight up town/scum game. So could we dispense with the thoughts that if someone is posting weird then that they are doing that because of a role and assume that they are doing that for their own amusement. Feel free to ignore them if you find that posting irritating.

The amusing this is that we're not attacking Eloth for RP. We're attacking Eloth for what seems like a possible signaling and for being exceptionally uncooperative.

As Shelly said; if this had been about RP you would have been on the block and not Eloth.

Although I appreciate your attempt to find something to argue about to participate and all, I feel I must point out that it's wrong.

When that is said, RP never was widely accepted in our games. This mythical past where all was frolicking amongst fields of RP and flowers did in fact never exist.

I beg to differ. There was quite a long stretch were RPing on day one or rather the more well known version (spam) was the rule rather then the exception.

I have tried to make clear that what I am saying is in no way a attempt to distract from the lynch of either Eloth or Merrid but instead a note on how the last several games have progressed.

For the most part I believe that people have understood what I was trying to say and not assume that I was in any way attempting to defend either Eloth or Merrid. My small rant is based off of how people reacted to both my rping and to anyone elses rping.

[Tulas Shorn]

Merrid, on 24 January 2012 - 07:13 PM, said:

I'm fine with RPing. I'm not fine with going overboard with text translated to Japanese, paragraphs written in tiny font, etc. That's not RP it's just annoying. Overall though I don't think the RP is as much the problem as that people are waaaaaay too fixated on this idea of day 1 signaling, something which rarely actually happens and 99% of the time isn't even seen by the signal target when it is done on purpose. To these people EVERYTHING looks like a signal and then there's defense against terrible cases and it all boils over rather quickly, and if you try to keep RPing just a bit you get accused of being non-chalant.

Here's the thing. RP'ing does not have to be big expository paragraphs. It's just a bit of variation in how you talk on-thread. In a game like this you could talk very proper and dignified, addressing everyone with lofty titles and bowing a bunch.

Ahh but this is a game set in tradition feudal Japan. Posting in Japanese is the ultimate RPing for that time period. If I had started off talking about Ninja's then that would have been immediately assumed to be suspicious and voted for.

If that is how you want to RP then go right a head. For me though I wanted to talk in Japanese. Plus I thought that it would be a nice nod to Shin.

[Karatallid]

Quickly on thread for mere minutes, I have a football tournament to go win. How long we have left? It must be close to timeout, we look to be settling for no lynch today and I thought CF's would still be important. You're all discussing RPing? Is that the gist, I don't have the time but I think we have less than 30 minutes am I right or wrong?

[Karatallid]

Path-Shaper, on 24 January 2012 - 02:50 PM, said:

It is Day 1. 6 Hours and 16 minutes Left.

20 Players still alive: Atrahal, Eloth, Fener, Galayn Lord, Karatallid, Kessobahn, Korlat, Korvalain, Liosan, Merrid, Okaros, Olar Ethil, Omtose, Osseric, Sheltatha Lore, Shadow, Silanah, Sorrit, Tiamatha, Tulas Shorn

11 Votes to Lynch. 10 to go to night.

1 Vote Atrahal: Tulas Shorn
1 Vote Tulas Shorn: Atrahal
4 Votes Merrid: Eloth, Sorrit, Olar Ethil, Shadow
5 Votes Eloth: Shetatha Lore, Liosan, Okaros, Galayn Lord, Karatallid

Players not voting: Fener, Kessobahn, Korlat, Korvalain, Merrid, Omtose, Osseric, Silanah, Tiamatha

This was today so timeout should be...

[Karatallid]

1 Hour 20 minutes time?

How are we for votes since this?

[Karatallid]

6 votes for Eloth
5 votes for Merrid.

That is how it stands my ride is here in less than 5 minutes. I have my vote on Eloth. To me there is not another lynch worthy candidate and I don't think we have the numbers online.

[Karatallid]

8 Anoms and no replies? Serious?

[Shadow]

While I agree, Tulas, that people don't know how to deal with RPing, that's not the point of (atleast my) Merrid vote. Korean RP in a Japanese game. Whatever, if you want to be obnoxious like that it's fine. No hard feelings at all toward Merrid. But then Eloth is the only other person to also post in Korean. Doesn't seem random, and I'm willing to test it.

I also don't agree with people saying that signaling is useless in faction games. I have little doubt that there are low or no ability people in each faction. They are, essentially, symps for their Leader. And no one can claim that it does no good for the Leaders to know their team. They could have killing powers, and at the least could avoid starting a train on their minions.

I see other people reacted similarly to me. Don't hold that against me, I'm currently catching up.

Tulas Shorn, on 24 January 2012 - 06:55 PM, said:

I would like to point this out.

Silanah 5
Korlat 4
Sorrit 3


If this continues it will become unacceptable. There are already over 300 posts. Surely people can find enough information on this thread to make more then 5 posts.

How many posts do I have, 6? It's day 1, what do you expect? Of course some people are going to lay low. Low posting accusations already... lordy lord.

I don't mean to react so negatively to all your posts, TS. I'm very much on your side when it comes to RPing. It's unfortunate that most of day 1 was me from my phone, unable to join the translation-fest.

Well, I'll be around from my phone, to change my vote and participate in conversation if needed.

[Kessobahn]

I'm being called away, should be back before time out

[Merrid]

might as well...

remove vote
vote Eloth

Usual merc game logic: AFAIK he's not on my team!

[Omtose]

Out of Merrid and Eloth i'd be much more inclined towards voting Eloth myself. I think everyone is feeling unsure on the whole voting thing at the moment considering the chance of hitting team members and allies, that coupled with it being day 1 seems ti be making it look like there is a chance of no lynch. The benefit of a lynch though would be seeing what kind of information the CF will give out and it may benefit us to have something extra for day 2.

[Omtose]

Damn hitting post without finishing typing.

I've got the tab open and i'm checking up when I can but might not get a chance to before the time out.

For being generally unhelpful, overreacting and generally making a big deal of things when he could have just answered the questions presented to him:

Vote Eloth.

[Shadow]

So that's 8 for Eloth, 5 Merrid? 45ish minutes left. I'll just go ahead and

[bold]Remove Vote[/bold]

[bold]Vote Eloth[/bold]

Let's get a lynch, I suppose.

[Shadow]

Remove Vote

Vote Eloth

stupid phone

[Atrahal]

it's not bold, it's


anyhow, seems even merrid is voting Eloth
[b] remove vote

vote Eloth

sayonara, eloth-kun

[Korvalain]

I'm here till lynch. Looks like we need 2 more to show if Shin counts Shadows vote. (I think you need to put a space between the text being bolded and the bracket). Gonna go do a quick read up on the last 2 pages.