[QuickTidal]

Jean-Claude Van tiam, on 03 October 2012 - 08:46 AM, said:

Has anyone seen the new special features on the DVD edition and do they explain anything at all? I thought this film was average but the more I read this thread on what inconsistencies it had the more I disliked it.

Don't know yet, the BRD doesn't drop till next Tuesday.

[A Demon Llama!]

must... refrain... from ... remembering... awfulness....

[A Demon Llama!]

Now that Prometheus is out on the blurays, I have a choice of seeing the film once again. I just know that it will make me angry again, probably more so as I'll know whats stupid shit is coming up, but maybe it will not and I can convince myself that is is better than it actually is. Supposedly there is 30 min of extra scenes that will not be included in the film as Ridley Scott has gone senile and apparently refuses to put scene that would make the film less stoopid and actuary explain a few things. So no Director's Cut.

Apparently Deleted Scene Explains Snake-Petting Biologist (the video is unfortunately available now but there's some vague explanation)

Also some deleted scenes here (14 min) Nothing really spectacular in these, in fact I can see why they were not included. Although there is a guy with a gun now, I don't think there was anyone with guns in the theatrical version while exploring, was there? Fuck safety measures.

Man, just thinking back on this movie has me down. Biggest movie disappointment ever for me. I needed the movie to be great, not just some mediocre BS. The worst part is how it is clear how there was potential and it shows how several awful decisions can really ruin something good.

I will most likely acquire the movie, watch though the extra scenes and edit the damn thing to my liking, even though I will agree with those that will say that someones "art" should not be tampered with.

[QuickTidal]

It sounds to me like you have less than no reason to re-watch it...and your comments are tantamount to re-complaining about something you've already complained about...which doesn't really add much to the thread I guess?

I get that you're disappointed, but I'm not sure I see what your last post was meant to express, except to reiterate your upset about the film you already had. Or perhaps I misinterpreted what you were trying to say?


Having watched the deleted and alternate scenes on the BRD, with commentary I have this to add:

The scene's themselves for the most part are character development scenes with further depth about the crew and their relationships. They were mostly cut for running time or pacing. The alternate opening has a number of Engineer's of varying ages on the hillside near the waterfall and they give the Sacrificial Engineer the pea-tree dish of DNA goo to use. It was cut for running time and because they thought that just showing one Engineer (the sacrificial one) was more mysterious. The alternate ending is basically an extended version of the survival pod scene leading to Shaw's fight with the Engineer, and then a longer cut of the scene with David's head explaining what the Engineer said to him earlier on.

So not a lot different there, and even the depth-adding character scenes don't remotely warrant a Director's Cut...and after viewing them I can understand why Ridley is so adamant that the theatrical version is HIS Director's version completely.

I've yet to re-watch the entire film, but even watching the deleted scenes I'm excited to re-watch it.

I really get the notion from those involved on the commentary tracks that the intention with the film was to tell the story of an old man who wanted to live forever, and decided to go and ask the gods to allow him to.

Seriously, love this film.

Oh and a sidenote: Peter Weyland's 2023 TED Talk is on the disc, as are the David Happy Birthday clip and one with interviews of the crew before they left and then there is one I'd not seen which is a video call to Peter Weyland from Elizabeth Shaw in which she petitions him to allow her to go on the trip for the 50th time...now at this point we know that Weyland Corp. is working on its own right? Well her clip has been recorded by "Yutani Photo-Polygraph Technologies" which shows a running stats about "honesty" "Coercion" and "excitement" amongst measuring other things. So the first mention of the Yutani part of the eventual "Company" Weyland-Yutani is a software designed to seek the truth.

Sorry, thought it was interesting.

Oh and Weyland's database is present in which he talks about his friend who told him to "put his toys away" and come rule the world with him from his company....which overlooks the city from a huge pyramid. Ha! Linking Blade Runner's Dr. Eldon Tyrell and Welyand as friends and seemingly peers.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 11 October 2012 - 01:00 AM

[A Demon Llama!]

Just felt like since the release was here I would like to explore the deleted scenes in hopes that some questions would be answered, or maybe some fleshing of the characters. Yeah I guess I am complaining again, but who doesn't like to complain? Sure it added to the thread; you responded to me and gave me some info. Did you by any chance see that scene or scenes that is supposed to explain why that guy went up to the snake? I read that it was his own snake that he lost or something and it mutated? That would kind of make sense with that other dude getting mutated and going berserk. Some serious side effect of the goo. I did wonder where that snake came from, since it didn't seem like part of the stages of the xenomorph evolution.

I dunno how I feel about the Blade Runner connection, but I don't think it means anything I guess. Ridley Scott already kinda hinted that it is in the same universe by showing the same fuel type or fuel gages or something with Alien and Blade Runner. I think it was you who pointed that out earlier.

Edit: In this case every time I complain or pose questions I am hoping to be proven wrong and to see that it does make sense.

This post has been edited by A Demon Llama!: 11 October 2012 - 01:25 AM

[QuickTidal]

A Demon Llama!, on 11 October 2012 - 01:22 AM, said:

Just felt like since the release was here I would like to explore the deleted scenes in hopes that some questions would be answered, or maybe some fleshing of the characters. Yeah I guess I am complaining again, but who doesn't like to complain? Sure it added to the thread; you responded to me and gave me some info. Did you by any chance see that scene or scenes that is supposed to explain why that guy went up to the snake? I read that it was his own snake that he lost or something and it mutated? That would kind of make sense with that other dude getting mutated and going berserk. Some serious side effect of the goo. I did wonder where that snake came from, since it didn't seem like part of the stages of the xenomorph evolution.

I dunno how I feel about the Blade Runner connection, but I don't think it means anything I guess. Ridley Scott already kinda hinted that it is in the same universe by showing the same fuel type or fuel gages or something with Alien and Blade Runner. I think it was you who pointed that out earlier.

Edit: In this case every time I complain or pose questions I am hoping to be proven wrong and to see that it does make sense.

Fair enough.

Yeah, the deleted scene with the biologist is him finding a small worm that they case up from the goo, which gives context to later when he sees the worm has mutated into the snake vagina which is why he's less than careful with it. It's not perfect context for his Steve Irwin-ish idiocy in trying to touch the snake vagina, but it's gives it a bit more of a weighty connotation I guess.

[McLovin]

I'm tempted to re-watch just to see my wife's reaction to it.

[Abyss]

Finally saw this. It was... ok.

There was some sf wonder to it and i liked the notion of the aliens as a failed Engineer weapons project. The pregnancy thing was suitably creepy. I could overlook the 'stupid scientists' element.

On the negative side the Weyland plotline was predictable and the 'let's go kick their asses' note at the end was just silly.

Where this failed more than anything was in not developing the pilot or crew to any degree that allowed the 'ram the ship' thing to make sense or have any real impact (pun intended) beyond the ka-boom.

A decent enough sf flick overall. I wonder if it may have worked better if it had been developped entirely independent of the ALIENS connections.

[McLovin]

Abyss, on 11 October 2012 - 03:40 PM, said:

Where this failed more than anything was in not developing the pilot or crew to any degree that allowed the 'ram the ship' thing to make sense or have any real impact (pun intended) beyond the ka-boom.

Yeah, the main cast was actually too large. Not enough moments to give to everybody to make you care about them. Idris Elba was barely in the film, which is a total waste.

Cutting the crew down to Shaw, Vickers, David, Weyland, and The Captain could have vastly improved the film.

[QuickTidal]

McLovin, on 11 October 2012 - 06:21 PM, said:

Abyss, on 11 October 2012 - 03:40 PM, said:

Where this failed more than anything was in not developing the pilot or crew to any degree that allowed the 'ram the ship' thing to make sense or have any real impact (pun intended) beyond the ka-boom.

Yeah, the main cast was actually too large. Not enough moments to give to everybody to make you care about them. Idris Elba was barely in the film, which is a total waste.

Cutting the crew down to Shaw, Vickers, David, Weyland, and The Captain could have vastly improved the film.

Indeed. A fair point.

[Abyss]

QuickTidal, on 11 October 2012 - 06:24 PM, said:

McLovin, on 11 October 2012 - 06:21 PM, said:

Abyss, on 11 October 2012 - 03:40 PM, said:

Where this failed more than anything was in not developing the pilot or crew to any degree that allowed the 'ram the ship' thing to make sense or have any real impact (pun intended) beyond the ka-boom.

Yeah, the main cast was actually too large. Not enough moments to give to everybody to make you care about them. Idris Elba was barely in the film, which is a total waste.

Cutting the crew down to Shaw, Vickers, David, Weyland, and The Captain could have vastly improved the film.

Indeed. A fair point.

Yep. They gave Elba that one token scene of character development that in no way at all foreshadowed or justified the self-sacrifice, the crew's loyalty or even any of their presence in the movie. ALIEN worked with a medium cast and cut them down steadily to the main players. ALIENS had a huge cast but managed to establish enough about them early that when the shit went down on the marines for the first time the viewer cared. This film did none of that. It gave us three, maybe four characters to focus on and the rest were painfully obviously equivalent of 99% of the average slasher movie cast without the gratuitous nudity.

A tighter cast would have worked wonders for this film.

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 11 October 2012 - 07:20 PM, said:

Yep. They gave Elba that one token scene of character development that in no way at all foreshadowed or justified the self-sacrifice, the crew's loyalty or even any of their presence in the movie. ALIEN worked with a medium cast and cut them down steadily to the main players. ALIENS had a huge cast but managed to establish enough about them early that when the shit went down on the marines for the first time the viewer cared. This film did none of that. It gave us three, maybe four characters to focus on and the rest were painfully obviously equivalent of 99% of the average slasher movie cast without the gratuitous nudity.

A tighter cast would have worked wonders for this film.

There are a further two scenes with Elba's character that deepen his character in the deleted scenes.

[Abyss]

QuickTidal, on 11 October 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

Abyss, on 11 October 2012 - 07:20 PM, said:

Yep. They gave Elba that one token scene of character development ...

There are a further two scenes with Elba's character that deepen his character in the deleted scenes.

Imnsho, delected scenes don't excuse the screen version (that Scott stands by apparently) where the (arguable) climax of the film relies on an action taken by a character the audience barely knows or cares about. Still a tick on the fail column for me, especially because ALIEN and other films clearly and repeatedly demonstrate that Scott is perfectly capable of doing a perfectly credible noble-self-sacrifice scene and knocking it out of the park... FFS he directed GLADIATOR...

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 11 October 2012 - 08:03 PM, said:

QuickTidal, on 11 October 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

Abyss, on 11 October 2012 - 07:20 PM, said:

Yep. They gave Elba that one token scene of character development ...

There are a further two scenes with Elba's character that deepen his character in the deleted scenes.

Imnsho, delected scenes don't excuse the screen version (that Scott stands by apparently) where the (arguable) climax of the film relies on an action taken by a character the audience barely knows or cares about. Still a tick on the fail column for me, especially because ALIEN and other films clearly and repeatedly demonstrate that Scott is perfectly capable of doing a perfectly credible noble-self-sacrifice scene and knocking it out of the park... FFS he directed GLADIATOR...

Pssst. He didn't write it. Your gripe is with Damien Lindelof and David Spaiths, not Ridley.

Again, everyone always ascribes too much to the director when it comes to writing.

And though there is a bit of deeper Janek character development in the deleted scenes it certainly wouldn't be enough to appease what you appear to be seeking.

[A Demon Llama!]

Jon Spaihts' Original ALIEN Prequel Script Has Escaped Into The Wild

"Spaihts' draft is very similar to the finished film in many ways - except the finished film ruins or dumbs down aspects of his script. They're on LV-426 in his draft. The guys who get lost in the pyramid? The script acknowledges the stupidity and makes it a character moment. It includes this great line: 'To Milburn and Fifield. The first human beings to freak out, get lost, and sleep in their suits in the ruins of an alien civilization.'

"The ship isn't called Prometheus. The connection between human and Engineer DNA is explained. The construction of the pyramids on Earth is explained! The scientists don't get stupidly bummed out when they find the Engineers dead - they're excited by what this means for science and understanding! Weyland wants to find the Engineers not for dumb eternal life, but for terraforming technology! And the end is better!"



You can download it if you want. I haven't read it yet but will.

Edit: I actually watched the film again and managed to enjoy the movie a lot more that the first time.

QT you say not to blame the director for the writing, but shouldn't he see that something is stupid and fix it? Especially someone as experienced as Scott. Not to bring up what was said a ton of times already but I was surprised that he agreed and approved these things. I'm not too familiar with what a Director can do, but doesn't he have ultimate power over the script and everything else?

I'm afraid hes loosing his touch. At least Prometheus was a lot better than that God awful Robin Hood movie.

This post has been edited by A Demon Llama!: 12 November 2012 - 10:38 PM

[QuickTidal]

A Demon Llama!, on 12 November 2012 - 10:24 PM, said:

QT you say not to blame the director for the writing, but shouldn't he see that something is stupid and fix it? Especially someone as experienced as Scott. Not to bring up what was said a ton of times already but I was surprised that he agreed and approved these things. I'm not too familiar with what a Director can do, but doesn't he have ultimate power over the script and everything else?

I'm afraid hes loosing his touch. At least Prometheus was a lot better than that God awful Robin Hood movie.

Well it depends on what he wants to change. If he wants to change anything major then he not only has to go through the Screenwriters union for approval of each change, the writers have to agree otherwise the producer makes the call, and the studio also has to agree. I would wager that since Scott is such a big director he has the clout to make those changes if he wants. He is also the one who had Lindelof brought in, so he kind of had to stand by Lindelof's changes. I can only speculate, but I think if he had any serious issues with it he'd have called them out...but perhaps he sees the film the way I do and doesn't see those things as stupid the way you do? In this case he has much more control over what came out than another director who have....Ridley is a BIG name and has clout.

Re: ROBIN HOOD, unlike KINGDOM OF HEAVEN, is not better in the directors cut version. That said, his input on ROBIN HOOD was much more influential, the original script which was called NOTTINGHAM was a script that portrayed a more sympathetic Sheriff of Nottingham and less virtuous Robin Hood, who becomes involved in a love triangle with Lady Marion. That would have been excellent and inventive methinks...but Scott didn't love that a script and neither did Russel Crowe they both had a new writer hired (both were a producer) and Brian Helgeland was brought in to traditionalize it...and his work is DECIDEDLY hit and miss...but that's not even the worst bit...the production was SO controlled by Scott and Crowe that Crowe was able to have a friend (Alan Doyle lead singer of the Canadian band Great Big Sea) brought in as a main character because he could "sing"...shame he can't act...That production is a GREAT example of Riodley having too much power.

In the case of PROMETHEUS I think he had a bit less power, but overall it's probably just that he doesn't see the issues with the script in that way. Plus, Ridley is well known to be an arrogant SOB when he wants to be, so there's that as well.