Malazan Empire: Old Guard Last Supper - Malazan Empire

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Old Guard Last Supper

#41 User is offline   Whiskey Bass 

  • Grand High Cook of High House Bass(e)
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  • "Dont gain the world and lose your sole, wisdom is better than silver and gold"

Posted 10 January 2012 - 10:19 PM

View PostD, on 09 January 2012 - 07:19 PM, said:

Looking great so far!

View PostWily Tuchuk, on 09 January 2012 - 05:44 PM, said:

View Posttiam, on 19 October 2011 - 07:51 PM, said:

Im chanelling some reread quote fu atm. Its good getting a reread in but it causes me to write beastly comments in the book forums :rofl:

EDIT- Just remembered something regarding age. WJ claims in GOTM I think maybe in the prologue that Kellenveds not the only one who remembers Surly as a serving wench, which given the timeline were familiar with seems incorrect.

Then again the timelline is not important.



imo 90% of the regular posters on this site who have come up with their own theory and decided that Whiskeyjack was not one of the 'family' are probably wrong.

why do i think this ?

well the fact he remembers Surly this early, their attitude and manner of speaking to each other and many other little things.

also i've now read the full series and the few times 'family' members have been discussed or listed, the conversation is interupted or trails off and is left unsaid (as in the case of Amaron in RotCG)


He has a sister who is in her forties at absolute most (but seems much more like she's in her twenties or thirties)

we know very little about her, all we do know is that her age isn't mentioned and she is attractive enough for Leoman, so she could be anywhere from 18 to 45

and has no conceivable reason to have received aging-slowing High Denul treatments, lived in Azath house or anything like that.

irc she was taken by Whiskeyjack from a temple of Hood, at an unknown time. There's no mention that i remember of how long she had been there, or what ranking she had in the hierarchy, its possible she was a priestess and had access to these treatments. Same goes for Whiskeyjack we have no way of knowing whether he dabbled with High Denul potions or rituals

How exactly did WJ's poor father/mother (I forget which one is the common parent) spawn two children a hundred years apart (again without being an Ascendant or living in an Azath)?



It wouldnt be inconceivable that Whiskeyjacks family are a successful Stone Mason family firm, with money of their own for High Denul treatments (it is Malaz Isle afterall with a huge number of witches, Hedge wizards and other powers at that time).

Or maybe his father could have sired Whiskeyjack as a young 16 year old himself and as an older widowed man of 65 could have remarried much younger than himself, fathering his sister who is a good 50 years younger than her 'big bro'

i realise that the above is conjecture, but your theory is also merely conjecture and therefore no more or less relevant than mine.

if i or someone else could, i would ask SE himself on a forum Q&A

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#42 User is offline   tiam 

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 10:38 PM

View PostWily Tuchuk, on 10 January 2012 - 10:19 PM, said:

View PostD, on 09 January 2012 - 07:19 PM, said:

Looking great so far!

View PostWily Tuchuk, on 09 January 2012 - 05:44 PM, said:

View Posttiam, on 19 October 2011 - 07:51 PM, said:

Im chanelling some reread quote fu atm. Its good getting a reread in but it causes me to write beastly comments in the book forums :rofl:

EDIT- Just remembered something regarding age. WJ claims in GOTM I think maybe in the prologue that Kellenveds not the only one who remembers Surly as a serving wench, which given the timeline were familiar with seems incorrect.

Then again the timelline is not important.



imo 90% of the regular posters on this site who have come up with their own theory and decided that Whiskeyjack was not one of the 'family' are probably wrong.

why do i think this ?

well the fact he remembers Surly this early, their attitude and manner of speaking to each other and many other little things.

also i've now read the full series and the few times 'family' members have been discussed or listed, the conversation is interupted or trails off and is left unsaid (as in the case of Amaron in RotCG)


He has a sister who is in her forties at absolute most (but seems much more like she's in her twenties or thirties)

we know very little about her, all we do know is that her age isn't mentioned and she is attractive enough for Leoman, so she could be anywhere from 18 to 45

and has no conceivable reason to have received aging-slowing High Denul treatments, lived in Azath house or anything like that.

irc she was taken by Whiskeyjack from a temple of Hood, at an unknown time. There's no mention that i remember of how long she had been there, or what ranking she had in the hierarchy, its possible she was a priestess and had access to these treatments. Same goes for Whiskeyjack we have no way of knowing whether he dabbled with High Denul potions or rituals

How exactly did WJ's poor father/mother (I forget which one is the common parent) spawn two children a hundred years apart (again without being an Ascendant or living in an Azath)?



It wouldnt be inconceivable that Whiskeyjacks family are a successful Stone Mason family firm, with money of their own for High Denul treatments (it is Malaz Isle afterall with a huge number of witches, Hedge wizards and other powers at that time).

Or maybe his father could have sired Whiskeyjack as a young 16 year old himself and as an older widowed man of 65 could have remarried much younger than himself, fathering his sister who is a good 50 years younger than her 'big bro'

i realise that the above is conjecture, but your theory is also merely conjecture and therefore no more or less relevant than mine.

if i or someone else could, i would ask SE himself on a forum Q&A



WJ is mentioned as being in his late forties in MOI by Spinnock and Fiddler and WJ used to bounce her on their knee suggesting they were at least teenager by the time she was born. They may also have been older 13 to successfully steal from the temple of Hood and sort of get away with it if thats relevant.
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#43 User is offline   Whiskey Bass 

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  • "Dont gain the world and lose your sole, wisdom is better than silver and gold"

Posted 11 January 2012 - 12:07 AM

View Posttiam, on 10 January 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

WJ is mentioned as being in his late forties in MOI by Spinnock and Fiddler and WJ used to bounce her on their knee suggesting they were at least teenager by the time she was born. They may also have been older 13 to successfully steal from the temple of Hood and sort of get away with it if thats relevant.



Are spinnock and Fidd going by his appearance? Of the 'family members that are listed they appear to have different ages, like Dujeck looks 60 ish plus, Urko looks 50's plus and Ameron is described as youngish looking, i guess the point is that the ageing proccess has effected them all differently.

Also we've no clue as to how long the BB were opperating up till the Mouse Quarter Riots, (which could be a good time for the 'rescue')

i get the idea that Whiskeyjack had already had a long career in the army before the attack at Aren and the treck through Raraku, and possibly another 10 or 20 years after that.

im not convinced that im right and others are wrong, but i think there's enough unkowns for the issue to be up in the air....if you know what i mean lol.
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#44 User is offline   tiam 

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Posted 01 February 2012 - 10:49 PM

View PostWily Tuchuk, on 11 January 2012 - 12:07 AM, said:

View Posttiam, on 10 January 2012 - 10:38 PM, said:

WJ is mentioned as being in his late forties in MOI by Spinnock and Fiddler and WJ used to bounce her on their knee suggesting they were at least teenager by the time she was born. They may also have been older 13 to successfully steal from the temple of Hood and sort of get away with it if thats relevant.



Are spinnock and Fidd going by his appearance? Of the 'family members that are listed they appear to have different ages, like Dujeck looks 60 ish plus, Urko looks 50's plus and Ameron is described as youngish looking, i guess the point is that the ageing proccess has effected them all differently.

Also we've no clue as to how long the BB were opperating up till the Mouse Quarter Riots, (which could be a good time for the 'rescue')

i get the idea that Whiskeyjack had already had a long career in the army before the attack at Aren and the treck through Raraku, and possibly another 10 or 20 years after that.

im not convinced that im right and others are wrong, but i think there's enough unkowns for the issue to be up in the air....if you know what i mean lol.


In the GOTM prologue (set after ghatan and the fall of Dassem) WJ is described as very young for a commander. In the MOI flashback with QB and the trail across Raraku WJ is also described as young.
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#45 User is offline   Whisperzzzzzzz 

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Posted 10 November 2014 - 11:20 PM

Corporal Nobbs, what ever happened with this?
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#46 User is offline   Corporal Nobbs 

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Posted 11 November 2014 - 02:46 AM

One of many abandoned paintings.
I will get back to it, eventually.
Rejoice. For very bad things are about to happen
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#47 User is offline   Dolmen 2.0 

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    Waiting till jean gets here.

Posted 08 October 2015 - 09:47 AM

View PostCorporal Nobbs, on 11 November 2014 - 02:46 AM, said:

One of many abandoned paintings.
I will get back to it, eventually.



This needs to happen.

Seriously :rolleyes:
“Behind this mask there is more than just flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea... and ideas are bulletproof Gas-Fireproof.”
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#48 User is offline   Grimjust Bearegular 

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Posted 13 October 2015 - 08:46 AM

This looks to be another awesome piece from you, Nobbs :)
Things and stuffs...and other important objects.
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