[CircleBinder]

I'm somewhat new to the fantasy genre. The only major works of fantasy I have read are Lord of the Rings, A Song of Ice and Fire, and now The Malazan Book of the Fallen - all of which I have enjoyed tremendously. While not extremely experienced with fantasy series's and subgenres, the latter two of those works are clearly not even close to the realm of traditional, classic fantasy established by the great LotR. I will always have a special place in my heart for the LotR, and as such would like to return to traditional epic fantasy series upon finishing MBotF.

What do you guys recommend as the best reading in the realm of classic fantasy? The two series's that I've been considering are Hobb's Farseer Trilogy and Memory, Sorrow, Thorn by Tad Williams. What do you think?

Thanks for the input!

[Kanese S's]

Everyone has very different tastes when it comes to that. "The Wheel of Time" is pretty well liked (I quite enjoy it, at least), but also much criticized. There's also the classic King Arthur stories if you're into traditional type stuff.

[Binder of Demons]

I am personally not that well read in terms of fantasy series, but there are 2 series I would consider classic fantasy for very different reasons.

1. The Earthsea Quartet by URSULA LeGUIN. Is basically a series of quite traditional magician's apprentice/ quest style fantasy novels. Very light reading in comparison to what you have read thus far, but well done.

2. The Chronicles of Amber by ROGER ZELAZNY. Is a far more unusual beast in that it has very modern feel at times (in terms of writing style and dialogue), but incorporates many familiar classic old fantasy/mythology settings and characters into it's storyline. Not really a Tolkien style fantasy either though.

The only author I've read who may approximate what you are after is Terry Brooks, who is very much the definition of Tolkien lite. You get very clear good guys and bad guys, very straightforward magic systems, and and old wizard instigating a quest for an apprentice figure to defeat the evil doers (and not be corrupted by their new found power). He really found a formula and basically tweaked it for multiple trilogies. They were enjoyable light reading for me as it was long before i read Erikson or Martin, but your mileage may vary.

I expect you will get recommendations for the likes of Jordan, Feist and maybe early Eddings as well, but i have never read these.

[Use Of Weapons]

I'd have to go with _Magician_, _Silverthorn_, _A Darkness At Sethanon_ by Feist. Magic, dragons, princes, poison, elves, dwarves, mines, priests, magic hammers. Follow it up with the Empire series for purest classic fantasy win.

[jdiddyesquire]

UseOfWeapons, on 17 June 2011 - 09:58 AM, said:

I'd have to go with _Magician_, _Silverthorn_, _A Darkness At Sethanon_ by Feist. Magic, dragons, princes, poison, elves, dwarves, mines, priests, magic hammers. Follow it up with the Empire series for purest classic fantasy win.

The Empire series is tremendous.

I generally think if you read Malazan and liked it there's going to be some disappointment moving to other things in the genre. There just isn't anything else really like Malazan. Bakker is the closest thing I think.

[POOPOO MCBUMFACE]

The Magician series is probably the closest thing I can think of, but I didn't really enjoy it after the first book, Magician. Magician was good for what it was, and definitely a fun read, but Silverthorn/Sethanon... bleh. Definitely read Magician, though.

This post has been edited by POOPOO MCBUMFACE: 17 June 2011 - 03:38 PM

[Abyss]

'Classic fantasy' is one of those itchy categories that are fairly subjective. one person's 'classic' is another persons 'new weird'.

For moi, when i look to the 'classics', these are what come to mind...

Eddings' BELGARIAD and MALLOREAN. Quite YA, but unlike say, Lewis' Narnia or Alexander's Prydain and other early YA fantasy series, if you're not too entrenched in the tropes of the genre you'll probably enjoy them on an adult level, plus you get to meet Silk, one of the all time greatest characters in the history of the genre. I would not rcommend anything Eddings wrote after these, however. Ten books total, series completed, although there are some additional books retelling parts from diferent perspectives.

FEIST's MAGICIAN, SILVERTHORN and DARKNESS AT SETHANON, and the related EMPIRE 3-part series written with Wurts. There's something immensely satisfying about this series despite its 'farm boy levels up' origins, and the EMPIRE series is phenominally original. Ymmv for subsequent books, but these are true classics. Six books, with piles and piles of subsequent series still going, but the originals read perfectly as a complete set.

Fritz Leiber's LANKHMAR series. A bit pulpy, but Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser's adventures are timeless and great fun. No farmboys here, these heroes are hard fighting, horny and hilarious. Collected in various forms, all self-contained.

Weis and Hickman's DEATHGATE series. I know many people would send you to their DRAGONLANCE stuff, but I thought this series was far better written, more interesting, and plays with a lot of the classic tropes in fun ways. Seven books and done.

Joel Rosenberg's GUARDIANS OF THE FLAME. Once upon a time, there were not a thousand series that started 'here we are to play an RPG... OMG the whole thing was real! and now we're our characters! what do we do?!?!? Hey, let's bring american values to fantasyland!'.. rather, there was this series. And it was brilliant. Six or seven books, available from tor in collected editions, worth tracking down and surprisingly not at all dated. And a very realistic depiction of trying to bring sanity to a world where slavery, with all its ugly byproducts (read: rape) are a main industry. Plus Ellegon, one of the bestest dragons ever.

Zelzany's AMBER. I don't hold as much love for this series as some, but it's worth a look. Done, collected.

Moorcock's ELRIC. The original anti-hero with a big stabby sword. Moorcock's work generally is worth checking out but this most of all. Done, collected.

Any of Howard's CONAN books are worth reading, in whatever order.


- Abyss, enjoyed thinking about this.

[Baco Xpuch]

Actually, it's funny you should mention Dragonlance cause that's what I was going to recommend. Dragonlance Chronicles and Legends were the books I read after Lewis's Narnia and Lord of the Rings. It's about as traditional as fantasy gets in my opinion. Now, I definetly like the Deathgate Cycle better but I don't believe it's traditional fantasy. Another suggestion would be J.V. Jones Book of Words (starts with A Baker's Boy), Tad Williams, Memory, Sorrow, Thorn (though you already mentioned it), and maybe if you're feeling a bit funny, a whole lot of Terry Pratchett. Now, I'm not nearly as well read as most people on this board but these series are definetly traditional fantasy (Pratchett, more a play on traditional while satirizing(?) the modern world). I don't remember how good the former two were because it's been ten years since I read Book of Words and nearly twenty since I read Dragonlance.

[End of Disc One]

Wheel of Time is my favorite traditional fantasy.

[Zakari39]

Hobb's Farseer trilogy is brilliant - the other ones after are good but not as brilliant.

Dragonlance and Belgariad definite must reads for classic Good vs Evil and Magic, and Magician is also very good.

Second the post about Silk from the Belgariad - he is basically the coolest thing since Kalam and Quick Ben.

[Mentalist]

out of the stuff not on the list yet,i'd strongly recommend the "Fionovar Tapestry"trilogy by Guy Gavriel Kay.

it may not follow the Tolkien format exactly, since it revolves around the "earth people transported to another world to save world" plot cliche, but once it gets going, a lot of more "classical" elements really come to the fore.

[Rooster]

Mentalist, on 17 June 2011 - 08:56 PM, said:

out of the stuff not on the list yet,i'd strongly recommend the "Fionovar Tapestry"trilogy by Guy Gavriel Kay.

it may not follow the Tolkien format exactly, since it revolves around the "earth people transported to another world to save world" plot cliche, but once it gets going, a lot of more "classical" elements really come to the fore.

On the basis of CS Lewis Narnia books I'd say portal fantasy is pretty traditional, with that in mind I'm going to chuck the Eldarn Sequence in here. Classic/cliched portal fantasy, clear good vs evil plot line complete with old wizard and apprentice characters. Not ground breaking in terms of ideas but not a bad read in my opinion.

This post has been edited by Rooster: 18 June 2011 - 08:30 AM

[King Bear]

My favourite "Tolkienesque" fantasies have been mentioned: Fiest's Riftwar books, the Death Gate Cycle, and The Wheel of Time.

I & most people think that the Riftwar series starts off awesome and chugs along nicely. Until it sharply goes downhill. The point when it goes downhill is a matter of interpretation. Depending on who you ask, it's after either book one, book 6 (the last book in the empire series), or book 11 (Rage of a Demon King). It's fine to end the series with any of these, since book one is self-contained, and book 6 ends a self-contained series, and book 11 pretty much ends another series. Book 12 ends that series properly, but is generally unnecessary and mostly awful.

The Wheel of Time is pretty damn awesome most of the time, but anyone getting into it should be warned that some books in the middle of the series seriously drag. The last few books have been brilliant however, and the stage is set for an incredible finale when book 14 arrives early next year. YES YOU SHOULD ALSO KNOW THAT IT'S 14 BOOKS LONG AND IT"S ALL ONE STORY!

The Death Gate Cycle is great from start to finish, but not quite as traditional as riftwar and WOT - mainly due to the inventive setting. As Abyss said it's much better than Dragonlance, a more famous series by the same authors.

Shannara is decent, but I'd never rave over it. Except for Elfstones of Shannara. I love Elfstones.

As others have said, Amber, Conan, Elric and Lankhmar are all excellent. Amber, although old, definitely a classic and highly recommended, isn't very traditional. I was pleasantly surprised how inventive and modern it felt, actually. The other three are in the sword and sorcery genre, which is a bit different from what Tolkien was doing.

If anyone recommends The Sword of Truth series to you, shoot them.

drunken post ends drunkenly klsjdfsljfsijfjdfsdf

edit: you said Memory Sorrow and Thorn had been recommended to you. That one is great too, forgot about that. Plus, it's three books and you're done.

I have read no Hobbs.

This post has been edited by Future Warrior: 18 June 2011 - 03:53 PM

[Mentalist]

Future Warrior, on 18 June 2011 - 11:34 AM, said:

My favourite "Tolkienesque" fantasies have been mentioned: Fiest's Riftwar books, the Death Gate Cycle, and The Wheel of Time.

I & most people think that the Riftwar series starts off awesome and chugs along nicely. Until it sharply goes downhill. The point when it goes downhill is a matter of interpretation. Depending on who you ask, it's after either book one, book 6 (the last book in the empire series), or book 11 (Rage of a Demon King). It's fine to end the series with any of these, since book one is self-contained, and book 6 ends a self-contained series, and book 11 pretty much ends another series. Book 12 ends that series properly, but is generally unnecessary and mostly awful.

The Wheel of Time is pretty damn awesome most of the time, but anyone getting into it should be warned that some books in the middle of the series seriously drag. The last few books have been brilliant however, and the stage is set for an incredible finale when book 14 arrives early next year. YES YOU SHOULD ALSO KNOW THAT IT'S 14 BOOKS LONG AND IT"S ALL ONE STORY!

The Death Gate Cycle is great from start to finish, but not quite as traditional as riftwar and WOT - mainly due to the inventive setting. As Abyss said it's much better than Dragonlance, a more famous series by the same authors.

Shannara is decent, but I'd never rave over it. Except for Elfstones of Shannara. I love Elfstones.

As others have said, Amber, Conan, Elric and Lankhmar are all excellent. Amber, although old, definitely a classic and highly recommended, isn't very traditional. I was pleasantly surprised how inventive and modern it felt, actually. The other three are in the sword and sorcery genre, which is a bit different from what Tolkien was doing.

If anyone recommends The Sword of Truth series to you, shoot them.

drunken post ends drunkenly klsjdfsljfsijfjdfsdf

edit: you said Memory Sorrow and Thorn had been recommended to you. That one is great too, forgot about that. Plus, it's three books and you're done.

I have read no Hobbs.

I'd argue that Death Gate ends rather weakly, and is realy nothing like Tolkien. that said, it was my first intro to fantasy (after the Hobbit), the first book i've read and enjoyed in English after coming to Canada was "the Hand of Chaos" (book 5), and throughtout the next few years i've hunted down and read all the books (in the following sequence: 5-3-6-2-4-7-1. Gotta love the public library system), followed by Darksword and dragonlance, so I will defend the goodness of death Gate cycle to the death.

(though really, there are some really GOOD things in Dragonlance. past the original trilogy, the Legends trilogy is several times better, and the follow up 4 volumes (Summer flame + the War of the Souls) really ramp up the "epic" feel, while getting far darker in nature. some of the associated authors are really good too, like Richard Knaak's stuff (Legend of Huma + anything and everything with Minotaurs), and some of the preludes novels are really decent, too.)


...okay, yeah I might be biased. I have one shelf in book case specifically for Dragonlance novels.

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 19 June 2011 - 05:26 AM

[Use Of Weapons]

There are a few others:

Janny Wurts: The Cycle Of Fire (_Stormwarden_, _Keeper Of The Keys_, _Shadowfane_), available as an omnibus. The best of the "it's fantasy, seems a bit cliché-- hey, waitaminute, there's technology! It's SF masquerading as fantasy! No fair!" genre, to which you could add Sheri Tepper's True Game series, McCaffrey's Pern novels, and a few others. I'd recommend the first few Pern novels, too.

Deathgate Cycle -- for sure. But also try "The Rose of the Prophet", which IMO is Weis and Hickman at the very top of their game.

[Abyss]

Future Warrior, on 18 June 2011 - 11:34 AM, said:

...Shannara is decent, but I'd never rave over it. Except for Elfstones of Shannara. I love Elfstones. ...

I would actually recommend the SHANNARA books as classics of the genre, with the qualifier that for what it's worth, the second book, ELFSTONES, is leaps and bounds better than the first, SWORD. SWORD could actually put you off the entire series. 'STONES, otoh, may draw you into it, and works perfectly well a starting point. Subsequent novels are consistent and i think worth your time.

Quote

edit: you said Memory Sorrow and Thorn had been recommended to you. That one is great too, forgot about that. Plus, it's three books and you're done...

Gah... MS&T... i know i stand aside from many on this, but i found this series hideously dreary and boring and i particularly have difficulty calling it 'classic' when there is barely an original idea to be found in it. But that's just my opinion.

[McLovin]

Abyss, on 20 June 2011 - 03:09 PM, said:

Quote

edit: you said Memory Sorrow and Thorn had been recommended to you. That one is great too, forgot about that. Plus, it's three books and you're done...

Gah... MS&T... i know i stand aside from many on this, but i found this series hideously dreary and boring and i particularly have difficulty calling it 'classic' when there is barely an original idea to be found in it. But that's just my opinion.

Nope, not just your opinion. Best cure for insomnia ever.

[King Bear]

Abyss, on 20 June 2011 - 03:09 PM, said:

I would actually recommend the SHANNARA books as classics of the genre, with the qualifier that for what it's worth, the second book, ELFSTONES, is leaps and bounds better than the first, SWORD. SWORD could actually put you off the entire series. 'STONES, otoh, may draw you into it, and works perfectly well a starting point. Subsequent novels are consistent and i think worth your time.

But Elfstones is the best

Sword of Shannara is an obvious and completely pointless LotRs clone, and a pretty weak book... Terry Brooks has admitted that he wrote it just to get published, and would strike the book from Shannara canon if it weren't for an anticipated fan backlash.

The other Shannara books are all fine though, more or less. Although I was disappointed by the high druid trilogy. I haven't read the genesis books, but have heard good things.

Abyss, on 20 June 2011 - 03:09 PM, said:

Gah... MS&T... i know i stand aside from many on this, but i found this series hideously dreary and boring and i particularly have difficulty calling it 'classic' when there is barely an original idea to be found in it. But that's just my opinion.

I've heard MS&T criticised several times before, and for those same reasons, so you're not alone on that. I found a lot to enjoy in it despite it's slow pace and general lack of originality. IMO it's a good read if you're looking for a fairly conservative LotRs style fantasy. And where outside of Tolkien's Tom Bombadil can you find spell flinging through song? Oh, wait, Badelle...

We SO need a Badelle vs Bombadil magic rap battle in next year's Suduvu cage match.

[Abyss]

Future Warrior, on 20 June 2011 - 03:38 PM, said:

But Elfstones is the best

No argument here. For its time, 'STONES was dark dark fantasy with a nicely original sideplot.

Quote

Sword of Shannara is an obvious and completely pointless LotRs clone, and a pretty weak book... Terry Brooks has admitted that he wrote it just to get published, and would strike the book from Shannara canon if it weren't for an anticipated fan backlash.

The other Shannara books are all fine though, more or less. Although I was disappointed by the high druid trilogy. I haven't read the genesis books, but have heard good things.

SWORD is... cute.... i suppose. It's actually kind of shocking how simple it is compared to STONES but it does complete the story.

I thought the HEIRS quad was excellent.

Quote

Abyss, on 20 June 2011 - 03:09 PM, said:

Gah... MS&T...

...where outside of Tolkien's Tom Bombadil can you find spell flinging through song? ...

NOT a selling point for that series.

I will back up a few posts and note that Lloyd Alexander's BOOK OF THREE/Prydain series, tho very YA, is good fun and has some nicely original concepts to it including a few that haven't been beaten to death since its writing.

[acesn8s]

So I've noticed a few people mention the Shannara series as a Tolkien clone. I'd suggested that it is influenced by Tolkien. If you want a Tolkien clone, read Dennis L. McKiernan's The Iron Tower series (or maybe you shouldn't).

Here are some of my recommendations:

Piers Anthony's
Incarnations of Immortality

Terry Brook's first 3 Shannara books
Sword
Elfstones
Wishsong (Note to Future Warrior - song magic)

David Eddings (formula-matic but fun)
The Belgariad
The Mallorian

The Elineum
The Tamuli

Robert Jordan's
The Wheel of Time (series should be compelete by the time you read the current books)

Guy Gavrial Kay's
The Fionavar Tapestry

Raymond Feist's
Riftwar Saga

Michael Moorcock's
Elric of Melnibone series

Robert Howard's
Conan stories

Steven Brust's
Khaavren Romances (you might want to read a book or two from his Vlad Taltos series first)
What the heck, add his Taltos novels to the list as well.

If you can find them,

Fred Saberhagen's
The Book of Swords

Robert Asprin's
Thieves' World compilations (shared world)