[Severian]

hi, after dassem wounded in the tent while temper and ferrule fighting claws temper got a knife and tried to stab dassem why did he do that?

[Bauchelain the Evil]

Because Dassem reflexes to to danger are able to kick in even if unconscious. It was the only way to wake him up

[MTS]

Exactly. Weakened as they both were, they couldn't take on all those Claws by themselves; they needed Dassem to wake up, and it was the quickest way to do it.

This post has been edited by MTS: 22 December 2010 - 11:59 AM

[HiddenOne]

Because Dassem is badder than the whole army, and stabbing him to death would only serve to wake him up angry from a deep sleep, and Temper wanted a fair fight = 3 vs. army

See earlier thread devoted to this subject, as well

[Abyss]

link fu: http://forum.malazan...?showtopic=8841

[Aptorian]

Actually as far as I recall, the theory was that Hood sent Dassem back to life.

The last thing he wanted was Dassem dying and showing up on his doorstep in ascendant ghost form in super pissed mode. So, when Dassem was about to die, he got bumped.

[Abyss]

i still go with Dassem being so opposed to Death that he has a reflex power-up to avoid it when Temper stabs at him.

[Aptorian]

Yeah, the notion that Dassem would resist his soul going to Hoods realm, was the other theory. I guess the notion that Dassem insta healed himself is more probable.

[MTS]

Well, it's either Hood intervened a la Whiskeyjack's leg, Dassem is so opposed to death he gets a 'reflex power-up', or it's just plain old preternatural reflex. I'm willing to go with plain-old reflex - no power-ups involved - since Possum (Jade?) screams to stop Temper immediately beforehand. There's enough time inbetween that Temper gets hit by a Claw, so Dassem had time to react to that. Doesn't need to be anything mystical.

[Severian]

İt seemed to me that dassem Has a skill against sneaky attacks granted by Hood maybe?

[Luzburg]

 Severian, on 26 December 2010 - 02:01 PM, said:

İt seemed to me that dassem Has a skill against sneaky attacks granted by Hood maybe?

Not likely seeing as thats exactly what put him there. I presume could be explained by the fact he was totally single minded in attacking the Grand Champion that he couldn't detect the claw attack. OR he ascended in the tent!!!

[Mock]

I kind of think that this IS the moment that Dassem ascends, although Temper's cryptic comments about Dassem "fluttering at death's door" (284) and having "sworn then rejected" (284) his soul to Hood complicate things. It almost seems like Surly is doing her best to keep Dassem barely alive. There is also something about the scene where Ferrule, Dassem and Temper part after their journey that suggests Dassem has already changed.

[Beezulbubba]

Nah... Dassem didn't ascend in the tent.

Also, Surly keeping Dassem barely alive served her greater plan. If Dassem would have died outright, the loyal soldiery (who witnessed the "Sword" defeat Surgen Ress in a battle that will be remembered in song and legend) would have mutinied. In other words, Surly gave the impression that she was doing all she could to heal Dassem, while all along the plan was for him to die. Temper and Ferrule ruined that plan.

[Jingospice]

Im almost positive that Dassem ascended way before the tent. I agree that his powers were granted by Hood, but he turned his back on Hood after Hood stole his daughter (does this mean killed?). Thats why Dassem has so much beef with Hood.
Quote from MOI
"Dassem Ultor, who was broken by Hood's taking of his daughter at the time of the Chaining......Dassem his champion - Dessembrae- had grown to rival his power"

So its clear that Dassem was already an Ascendant before this battle. I think his ascendant powers just allowed him to realize that he was in danger.

[Abyss]

I have zero doubt Dassem was already an ascendent at that point in the tent, since the split from Hood had already happened.
That said, i think he had not yet advanced to god-status. I think 'Dessembrae' came later.

[Ben Delat]

There is more to Dassems ascendancy than his relation to Hood.

Spoiler

I forgt which book it is when Tool is describing things to Toc and having flashbacks to when the Imass gave the title of First Sword to Dassem and how they didn't even realize what it meant to put that burden and gift on someone. I believe it all came together with the powers that come from being First Sword and the separation from Hood patronage as well as the near death experience. As Agayla mentions there are more ways to ascendancy than anyone knows.

I need to go back and find that part with Tool describing that time and what it truely meant.

Also brings up the sticky suituation in tCG when Tool says that the Imass rejection of him being first sword meant nothing as it was kellanvad on the bone throne who commanded him, not K'ron or whichever Imass it was leading at the time, if that is true then both Tool and Dassem were First Swords at the same time

This post has been edited by Bubba: 08 January 2012 - 12:32 PM

[iixiong]

Spoilers maybe

Spoiler

Hood boost him up with the a title in House Death and furthers the ascension along > Dies in Y'Ghatan and ascends > Wake up in tent as Dessembrae

This post has been edited by Abyss: 09 January 2012 - 03:08 PM
Reason for edit: LATER BOOK SPOILERS MODGOD'D OUT OF EXISTANCE

[Ben Delat]

Spoiler

while that is possibel he actually died->ascended during the YG fiasco but I believe it started before then, as I mentioned, with the Imass bestowing the First Sword title and all it meant on him, it is a point I think SE should have expanded on some more as it ends up being quite important to the whole Dassem/Dessembrae storyline.

In the end I think it can be majority agreement it was the impending danger of being stabbed that evoked Dassem's instincts/reflexes to wake him up in the tent. Whether they were mortal,ascendant or god-like reflexes can be argued forever, in the end I dont think it mattered, any of the three from mortal dassem to god dessembrae would have reacted to it, so it doesn't matter which stage he was at at that point IMO.

This post has been edited by Ben Delat: 09 January 2012 - 07:37 PM