[Abyss]

blackzoid, on 14 September 2011 - 11:01 AM, said:

You know, OST will probably be set before TCG. ...

What do you base that on?

MTS, on 14 September 2011 - 12:43 PM, said:

Abyss, on 13 September 2011 - 02:11 PM, said:

...
Otoh, Crokus and Apsalar are entirely enjoyable characters who i wouldn't mind seeing in action again.

No, they've been given the 'happy ending' treatment, in my mind either of them shouldn't be brought back to Darujhistan unless there's a credible reason... would simply be a baffling piece of 'fan service' in my mind.

In principle i agree with you, but in practice Cotillion has pulled Kalam, Crokus and Apsalar out of retirement at least once each in the MBF series.

By example, if there is anything to the Crkus is heir to a Tyrant-King theory, all the story needs is Humble Measure sending a cadre of assassins after him, and once Apsalar has finished filletting them while Crokus takes a nap, they find a clue that leads back to D'stan and off we go.

I don't want to see it happen, and i'd really prefer that ICE work with his own characters and the less developped ones like Torvald Nom, Blend & Picker and so on, but anything is possible.

[tiam]

OST probably wont be set before TCG given the events with Karsa and the end of TCG. It has to set up the Toblakai trilogy to an extent and Picker has been busy even during the limited flashback we see in TCG.

Agree with Abyss. Possible but unlikely. There was a 'finish where you started' level of finality I liked from TCG, with Fiddler claiming they will always need more soldiers and Apsalar finally returning home, both tying up the GOTM prologue nicely.

[Use Of Weapons]

Crokus is Mammot's nephew, and Mammot was a Jaghut authority, and possessed by Raest to boot. It's within the bounds of possibility that Crokus will be involved from that angle, perhaps to dispose of or inherit Mammot's possessions and research. I myself think he and Apsalar have had a satisfying ending and think that I'd prefer not to see ICE screw with or mess up their characters. There's plenty for him to get his teeth into, and he already has his Crokus figure in Kyle.

[Kanese S's]

MTS, on 14 September 2011 - 12:43 PM, said:

Abyss, on 13 September 2011 - 02:11 PM, said:

Thread necromancy strike HAI!

MTS, on 18 December 2010 - 01:30 PM, said:

... I hope it doesn't turn out that Crokus was descended of the Tyrants or the son of some massively important people or something, as that is far too cliche, but the elements are definitely there.

I agree - Crokus doing the 'long lost heir' thing would be serious fists of ham sotrytelling.

I AM however, curious whether ICE leaves Crokus aside where SE left him at the end of TCG, of draws him back.

His storyline in TTH would seem to have settled his remaining D'stan ties and moved him onwards. It would almost seem pointless to draw him back.

Otoh, Crokus and Apsalar are entirely enjoyable characters who i wouldn't mind seeing in action again.

No, they've been given the 'happy ending' treatment, in my mind either of them shouldn't be brought back to Darujhistan unless there's a credible reason for doing so, and I can't see one in this instance unless the book opens with Apsalar throwing a fishing hook at Crokus' head, or they get tired of smelling like fish and decide to go for a wander. Even doing that or the 'I miss home' angle won't work anyway, because that's been done and Crokus is himself done with Darujhistan - he has no reason to go back, as at this time he's missing an Obi-Wan-esque astral projection of Baruk saying 'you must come back! Darujhistan needs you!'. Darujhistan is bigger than Crokus and the other Phoenix Inn regulars, having Crokus appear would simply be a baffling piece of 'fan service' in my mind.

I agree. I could see them traveling in the future, if they do get tired of smelling all fishy (but then again, perhaps they're both of the mind that they've had quite enough adventure for a long, long time), but I doubt it would be to Darujhistan, as Crokus is done with it, and Apsalar doesn't have a strong connection to it.

[blackzoid]

Abyss, on 14 September 2011 - 02:19 PM, said:

blackzoid, on 14 September 2011 - 11:01 AM, said:

You know, OST will probably be set before TCG. ...

What do you base that on?

ICE has been quoted in the past (in some interview I can't remember) as saying that of his last two books, one will be simultaneous with TCG and one will surve as an epilogue to the entire ICE/SE arc.

Seeing as Skinner is the King in Chains and that the Jacuurku novel is next, (and thats where he hung out before RoTCG) I assume that will take place at the same time as TCG and will deal with the ending of the Skinner/Iron Bars arc with possibly the Segulah second thrown in) with the Assail novel as the epilogue.

Interesting enough, I am rereading Stonewielder at the moment and the oft quoted placement of that book after Toll the Hounds seems dead wrong to me. Why? Well Hood is still the God of death. Hoods position is a pretty universal time-placer in the books. He is one of, if not the most, important "every-day" prayed to god after all.


Edit:
From http://elitistbookre...-esslemont.html

"EBR: What does the future of your series hold for the readers?

Cam: As I mentioned, Orb Sceptre Throne will be out next. It is set in Darujhistan and follows up on Toll the Hounds quite closely. It is thus more or less contemporaneous with Stonewielder. Right now I am working on the next of the series, which follows events unfolding upon the continent of Jacuruku. The working title for this novel is City in the Jungle. After this (everything having worked out) I hope to tackle the final work of the main arc, which is titled, Assail."

Hmm, ok. So Stonewielder IS set after Toll the Hounds? So I guess the soldiers divinations of the Deck of Dragons have not been updated? Although I do have a memory of the TL army in SW saying something about them running out of Hounds of Light. Probably due to the attrition suffered in TTH.

Also, if OST is contemperious (more or less) with SW than it has to be before TCG I think. Of course that doesn't mean Crokus is in the area.

This post has been edited by blackzoid: 15 September 2011 - 02:46 PM

[blackzoid]

So, I'm going to re-necro this thread to basically say that I was right! OST was set before TCG. Oh ya.
Or at least the climax of TCG anyway.

As for predictions of where the last two ICE books will fit in, well I'm going to go with this as a nice combined ICE/SE reading order.

NoK
GOTM
DG
MOI
HOC
MT
TBH
RoTCG (ya, I know Toc Elder and Hoods comment in RG, plus the Skinner/Rhulad overlap. But its nice to put this here)
RG
SW (Hood's status, Moon in one piece. Its set before TTH. Ya so some of the hounds of light are nice and friendly and Cotillion mentions the whorl. So what)
TTH
OST (goddam you Morn/Orchid storyline. The two of you ruined a nice timeline)
BaB//DoD-TCG
Ass (Assail, the last ICE book which should serve as an epilogue to the entire series)


As you can see, there is a nice dynamic of an ICE book followed by a SE book for the later books.
I am putting BaB (Blood and Bone, the next ICE book) at the same time as the DoD/TCG double book as I am gambling that the Skinner storyline (and hopefully Kallor!) will be resolved simultaniously with the main SE climax.
Assail will serve as an epilogue to everything.

This post has been edited by blackzoid: 12 February 2012 - 08:18 PM