[Korabas]

Galain, on 02 December 2010 - 09:47 PM, said:

I'm more and more intrigued about the idea that YS's faction is the largest one. Like, it's a common town objective to "kill all the scum factions." And I think it's the two factions rising up against YS, right? The one thing that's sticking in my mind is that I believe D'rek has been using YS as the "bad guy" in her stories lately. I think she wants to kill off YS... lol. It's been a while since the last one, I may be remembering things incorrectly.

As she said in the sign-up, this is her version of the Battle of the Red cliffs, where Cao Cao (who died in an earlier game) attacked Liu Bei and ehm, a guy whose troops wear red and whose brother is this general who is both an athlete and a previous incarnation of Jimmi Hendrix.

Since both Cao Cao and Liu Bei are dead already, Yuan Shao became the new Cao Cao and HZ the new Liu Bei.

[Korabas]

Galain, on 02 December 2010 - 09:57 PM, said:

Korabas, on 02 December 2010 - 09:55 PM, said:

Galain, on 02 December 2010 - 09:35 PM, said:

Oh my god I have caught up and let me tell you... thank you for posting a lot. Good to see us at 11 pages.

OK, Ruse is just the new Mockra. RAAAAAAAAAAAGE is the new rage, so to speak. Like, you call someone out and suddenly they throw a hissy fit. But the original basis for his call out is bogus to me.

I'm a little addled with all of the names because I can't ever see damn pictures to go with them and then we have all of the Chinese names on top of it, but I think Kesso's voting Korabas for acting in a manner that according to Kesso's thinking basically advertises Korabas' faction. And Mockra is voting Rashan for, well, basically being stuck on Ruse all day and I think there's a tie to Serc or Mockra or something like that in there?

I don't think I can handle rereading all of that right now so hopefully I'm semi-right.

Fixed that for you.

I think there are plenty of signs that run contrary to Kesso's thinking. Hiding my faction/giving multiple signs is one of the things I concentrate on and I appreciate the same in my fellow players. Why?

Well, as soon as the line are drawn in the sand and the people have lined up on either side of it, the whole game comes down to what side's vig(s) or leader or guard or whatever lasts the longest. Since that is mostly down to luck, I prefer postponing the slugfest for as long as possible while skill is making a difference, thank you.

Moreover, suppose I know my leader.... How can I help him survive and take heat off him if my own (true) allegiance is really clear?

It's a vague case, really. It's not the first time that someone has made that kind of case in a faction game. It's pretty much never correct. If anything, all it says to me is that Kesso feels pretty good that you are not on his faction and he's trying to get you removed.

Zactly. Still kind of warrants a comment... especially since I can use it for other purposes, too.

[Rashan]

how do people know who is in their faction? where some people told whilst others weren't? i know what faction i am in but not who is in it. I like korabas as i get to talk to him in my prime time which is the daytime, but i don't know if we are in the same faction. Like i said earlier, ruse could be in my faction but i have still voted for him. i am going to bed shortly, do we think we will get a lynch in the next 10 hours? there is around 16 left so i will be back on around 830 when i leave, that will leave around 4 hours left until day end.

[Omtose]

Quote

It *will* be hard to tell who is in your faction, and it will *not* be a case of everyone knows their leader.

To quote D'rek from the sign-up thread. Some know, but it sounds like the majority don't.

[Korabas]

Rashan, on 02 December 2010 - 10:04 PM, said:

how do people know who is in their faction?

Sorry bud, but that's not a question we answer on thread in a faction game. Better ask it in spoilers if you get there (either during or after the game). It is nearly inevitable that you (think you ) have a better read of people you can directly interact with, rather than reading stuff when you get up in the morning.

However, judge the content, not the person saying it.
For example, by calling you out, Ruse made sure you'd vote him. One point of distancing there, if that was his intention. He also made a few people stand up for you. Which, if he knows you are in his faction, went a good way to making sure you'd be safe from a lynch for a while.

Quote

i am going to bed shortly, do we think we will get a lynch in the next 10 hours?

Tough to say. There may be a lynch, there may be a train when yuo wake up, there may be two trains to choose between, there may be no-one voting at all. Right now, it looks like consensus will be made during the euro-night. Little you can do about it, really.

[Kessobahn]

Korabas, on 02 December 2010 - 09:55 PM, said:

I think there are plenty of signs that run contrary to Kesso's thinking. Hiding my faction/giving multiple signs is one of the things I concentrate on and I appreciate the same in my fellow players. Why?

Well, as soon as the line are drawn in the sand and the people have lined up on either side of it, the whole game comes down to what side's vig(s) or leader or guard or whatever lasts the longest. Since that is mostly down to luck, I prefer postponing the slugfest for as long as possible while skill is making a difference, thank you.

This is why I don't like having to make a case in a faction game, since I'm not very good at faction games to start with.

The fact that two factions are actually allied by the setup - instead of merely for Day-to-Day expedience when finding a common enemy - really makes a hash of things. And some of the rules & standard Mafia common sense seem to get tossed out.

[Korabas]

Kessobahn, on 02 December 2010 - 10:11 PM, said:

Korabas, on 02 December 2010 - 09:55 PM, said:

I think there are plenty of signs that run contrary to Kesso's thinking. Hiding my faction/giving multiple signs is one of the things I concentrate on and I appreciate the same in my fellow players. Why?

Well, as soon as the line are drawn in the sand and the people have lined up on either side of it, the whole game comes down to what side's vig(s) or leader or guard or whatever lasts the longest. Since that is mostly down to luck, I prefer postponing the slugfest for as long as possible while skill is making a difference, thank you.

This is why I don't like having to make a case in a faction game, since I'm not very good at faction games to start with.

The fact that two factions are actually allied by the setup - instead of merely for Day-to-Day expedience when finding a common enemy - really makes a hash of things. And some of the rules & standard Mafia common sense seem to get tossed out.

See, this I do agree with.
I'm fairly sure that in a non-faction game, I'd probably have been called a symp or the high posting killer of the traditional strategy for a pair of scum in a few posts.

In a different kind of faction game (say, the Lies of Lock Lamorra one), more people would gamble that I'm probably not on their side, or that the odds are in their favor that I am not. However, roulettes like that are usually only reserved for low (content)-posters or people completely fucking up.

To my knowledge, I haven't done either, as of yet. Most certainly not the lowposting......

[Korabas]

Time to update the voting list.

Galain is back, he's still sensible.
Omtose explained himself and it was his only really weird post.
Kesso... it would be mostly OMGUS.
Tiamatha also explains himself, but... fuck, I just don't know. I do believe him about RL, but all the theory stuff, even more than usual (meta) coupled with a few remarks when people comment on that... it is all lacking so much interactivity and it is mostly not game centred, only when his own defense is concerned.

Vote Tiamatha.

because right now, he is just giving of weird vibes and seems to be playing a solo game.

[Tulas Shorn]

Path-Shaper, on 02 December 2010 - 07:50 PM, said:

Knowing that a mighty naval force would be the key to conquering Shang Yong and pushing on to Han Zhong, Yuan Shao had constructed a naval camp at the newly-conquered Xiang Yang. Among the many Jingzhou officers who surrendered, Wen Ping and Zhang Yun were well-known expert naval commanders. He commissioned them as chief naval commanders and entrusted them with training his northern forces in marine combat. The two commanders set up a row of twenty-four water lanes for communication; the larger boats formed the outer rim, enclosing the smaller like a city wall. At night the torches lit up the sky and river, while on land the camps, which stetched for three hundred li, sent up smoke and fire day and night.

Spies reported on the layout of the camp to Zhang Xiu's forces. The commanders were shocked: "With such an effectively orgnized naval force, and so many soldiers, how can we hope to overcome them?" Jia Xu laughed and replied, "Have no fear, gentlemen, I will set Yuan Shao's naval forces into disarray without loosing a single arrow!" The next day, Jia Xu sailed a small boat close to Xiang Yang to observe the enemy naval camp, and made sure that Yuan Shao's command tent could spot him observing. That evening, Yuan Shao conferred with his commanders: "The enemy has observed our camp with ease, but we know little of their own." "Your troubles are over, Your Excellency," said Peng Ji, an advisor. "Jia Xu and I were acquainted as children, but he is unaware that I am serving as a military advisor. I will go west, pretending to be arriving from the court, and while reminiscing will gather all the intelligence you need!"

So Jia Xu and Peng Ji's secret plots were each begun, but who would triumph in the battle of wits?

I'm getting a Spycraft vibe from these posts.....

[Tulas Shorn]

Korabas, on 02 December 2010 - 09:23 PM, said:

Rashan, on 02 December 2010 - 09:19 PM, said:

i'm on for a little bit, i'll catch up, have just seen that vote from Mockra. what a cheeky get, i went to bed last night and said to my girlfriend, "i'm too nice" she wouldn't understand so i didn't explain, but i gave a sympathy vote and kept you in. the main reason why was because of the sentence that said,

"THE ONE GAME that looks really good and i get voted off on the first day" or something similar. Maybe my first mafia mistake and i wish i just let you die.

i am happy to vote a few guys, but this has really annoyed me. I will go back and have a look through and decide where my vote will go.

Sentimentality and mafia seldom go together.

not for long, anyhow....

[Tulas Shorn]

Galain, on 02 December 2010 - 09:47 PM, said:

I'm more and more intrigued about the idea that YS's faction is the largest one. Like, it's a common town objective to "kill all the scum factions." And I think it's the two factions rising up against YS, right? The one thing that's sticking in my mind is that I believe D'rek has been using YS as the "bad guy" in her stories lately. I think she wants to kill off YS... lol. It's been a while since the last one, I may be remembering things incorrectly.

actually, since YS is the new Cao Cao, and the Winner of the big Chapter 3 game, his faction has been town in the last 2 rot3K minis....

[Tulas Shorn]

Korabas, on 02 December 2010 - 09:59 PM, said:

Galain, on 02 December 2010 - 09:47 PM, said:

I'm more and more intrigued about the idea that YS's faction is the largest one. Like, it's a common town objective to "kill all the scum factions." And I think it's the two factions rising up against YS, right? The one thing that's sticking in my mind is that I believe D'rek has been using YS as the "bad guy" in her stories lately. I think she wants to kill off YS... lol. It's been a while since the last one, I may be remembering things incorrectly.

As she said in the sign-up, this is her version of the Battle of the Red cliffs, where Cao Cao (who died in an earlier game) attacked Liu Bei and ehm, a guy whose troops wear red and whose brother is this general who is both an athlete and a previous incarnation of Jimmi Hendrix.

Since both Cao Cao and Liu Bei are dead already, Yuan Shao became the new Cao Cao and HZ the new Liu Bei.

Sun Ce, I believe.

[Korabas]

Well, I'm out, back before deadline.

[Emurlahn]

just caught up, not particulrly impressed with ruse, his case on rashan that he promised was worthless, i actually agree with rashan, saying that alot of ruse's posts were simply to up his post count, i think the same could be said about tiam, silchas and kass, i didnt really get much info out of the catch up posts that those three posted...

updated name list for those who care, im begining to think it may be wasting my time to continue, thinkin PS might come up with a name for all of Yuan shaos 500k soldiers just to mess with me



Zhang xiu(leader

zhuge jin

Jia Xu


Huang Zhong (leader)
Liu Zong

Pang Tong
Wei Yan
Kuai Yue, a former advisor to Liu Biao, is dead. (Liosan and High Mage Quick Ben)
Wei Xu's


Yuan shao(leader)Xiang River
Wen Ping ---defector = unknown originality, probable Huang

Wen Chou

Lü Kuang

Lü Xiang

Yang Dajang, chief officer of personnel of Yuan Shao's forces, is dead. (Serc and Lisheo

Peng Ji,

Zhang Yun

[Tulas Shorn]

the one s in italics are the possible "defectors". no?

[Emurlahn]

Korabas, on 02 December 2010 - 10:25 PM, said:

Tiamatha also explains himself, but... fuck, I just don't know. I do believe him about RL, but all the theory stuff, even more than usual (meta) coupled with a few remarks when people comment on that... it is all lacking so much interactivity and it is mostly not game centred, only when his own defense is concerned.

Vote Tiamatha.

because right now, he is just giving of weird vibes and seems to be playing a solo game.

distencing vote? especially after the idea that korb was sending out a STFU message to him b4 but
i too think tiam is a little suspicious, but why choose him to lynch?

[Tiamatha]

Silchas Ruin, on 02 December 2010 - 07:36 PM, said:

Ok all caught up. Sorry for the spam, but at work it's much easier for me to post in short spurts. Things I have noticed:

Ruse was low poster and is now a mid poster. Other than twat calling and past game speculation and calling others out, he hasn't done much. Way to look busy big dog.
Korabas started both trains. This leads me to believe he is very aware of at least his leader, and makes him likely not one of the three head honcho's
Kesso, had basically nothing till his Korabas vote, and while I am not sure of his reasoning at least he posted something.
Korabas' "STFU" post to tiamatha was very telling.


I haven't decided where i am going to vote yet, but I am leaning towards Tiamatha. I could see a rashan lynch, as his play has been very erratic and his outright declaration that he is anti-YS would hurt both his team, as well as the YS faction. I could also see a Mockra lynch, he raged at almost being lynched, which suggests a power role, and was defended by (Rashan?).

I am not sure... Lynching suspected power roles at this point can go both ways when you can't be sure who is on your team. I generally like to leave that up to the big wigs with the powerful NA's

The last line in this post I find interesting, He trying to suggest he got nothing or is not a powerful role, that he isn't a threat. Just reads as he downplaying his abilities.

Also this post in my view is the one with the most contribution, most of your other catching up posts were quotes and brief one liners following them.

I think your comments about Ruse and Korabas had been stated before, if not I apologise to you Silchas.

I'll give you that you believing that Korabas telling me to STFU is some original thinking and I want to hear why you think that, instead of just the vague statement that you left.

[Tulas Shorn]

Since people seem to be ignoring me, i'm gonna run off to work now. back in about 5 hours.

[Tiamatha]

Ok, so looking back over Korabas and his hard on for me.

Ok he complaining about me ignoring the lynch train on Mockra, I'm sorry but that was so cliche to malazan mafia that if I was to contribute all that would have happened was I would have got involved in a argument where I would be insulted and sworn at. I play mafia for fun not to be insulted and sworn at, yes I know tension can run high but I do try to leave off thread, it just common courtesy.

I can understand why some players see Korabus post as a STFU Tiam, if you then add his little defence of me when he said that he had alt guessed me and that my posts was no different from previous games. He then votes for me as he isn't sure thus looking like he distancing from me.

The problem is this is a faction game I said successful NA can win a game, but so does misdirection.

I do not think that Korabas who by my reading of his posts comes off as a reasonably smart guy, would so early in a faction game come out and hump one of his own teammates and give both him and me away.

If he is on my team. Worst Team mate ever.

As this is a faction game I think he fake symping and he done it perfectly.

Vote Korabas

[Mockra]

Rashan, on 02 December 2010 - 09:19 PM, said:

i'm on for a little bit, i'll catch up, have just seen that vote from Mockra. what a cheeky get, i went to bed last night and said to my girlfriend, "i'm too nice" she wouldn't understand so i didn't explain, but i gave a sympathy vote and kept you in. the main reason why was because of the sentence that said,

"THE ONE GAME that looks really good and i get voted off on the first day" or something similar. Maybe my first mafia mistake and i wish i just let you die.

i am happy to vote a few guys, but this has really annoyed me. I will go back and have a look through and decide where my vote will go.

I think the position stated before, that sentimentality and mafia seldom go together is incorrect. They often do, and your 'gut' feelings come into it a lot. But the difference here is that while I appreciate you letting me off the hook (being the L-1 vote as you were) it does not mean you get a free pass from me. Do not, EVER let someone being nice to you, keeping you alive, or coming to your defense make you think differently of them. If you think I am not in your faction, and preferably have some reasons to think so, vote me. If I think you're not in my faction, or if I'm being lumped in with you due to you being nice to me, I WILL vote you, lynch you, whatever.

The point is, in mafia, the boundary lines are constantly shifting. Between now and when one of us is dead, I may in turn come to your defense...or I may be the person who started the train on you. It's worse in faction games, because the mere idea of being associated with someone is enough to get them voting you to prove they are not. Don't take it personal, and I certainly don't think you should assume that letting someone live another day is going to stop them voting you.

(This all came around when we let n00bs off the hook - "nah, they can't be scum, and it would mean to lynch them..." type thing - and they WERE scum and they milked the noob-card for all it was worth. Same principle here, I'm sorry to say).

Galain, on 02 December 2010 - 09:35 PM, said:

Oh my god I have caught up and let me tell you... thank you for posting a lot. Good to see us at 11 pages.

OK, Ruse is just the new Mockra. RAAAAAAAAAAAGE is the new rage, so to speak. Like, you call someone out and suddenly they throw a hissy fit. But the original basis for his call out is bogus to me.

I'm a little addled with all of the names because I can't ever see damn pictures to go with them and then we have all of the Chinese names on top of it, but I think Kesso's voting Korabas for acting in a manner that basically advertises his own faction. And Mockra is voting Rashan for, well, basically being stuck on Ruse all day and I think there's a tie to Serc or Mockra or something like that in there?

I don't think I can handle rereading all of that right now so hopefully I'm semi-right.

I'm voting him for being associated with me, actually. I think Rashan's CF will prove/disprove the Serc-Rashan-Mockra triumvirate that has been proposed on thread, and while mine would at least clear my name, you'd end up lynching Rashan as well because he has also been associated with Serc, and my faction being revealed will have no bearing on his faction. Whereas I've been paired with both of them, and only both of them, so lynching Rashan will prove that it is either highly likely (if he's Yuan Shao's faction) or unlikely (if he's one of the Z's). Ergo, more informative.