[foolio]

thought some of you would find this interesting. Sorrit is the crucified Dragon, but I came across this todbit while rereading Toll of the Hounds....


Spinnock has just finished kind of lying to Seerdomin making himself sound like a unskilled, lucky, unimportant, second rate Tiste Andii when Seerdomin brings up seeing Anomander looking out over the Ocean when he takes walks by himself....page 55 online google books version of Toll of the hounds(page 64, I think, of american hardback)

Quote

He favours....solitude," Spinnock said.
"I am always suspicious of that statement," Seerdomin said.
Yes I can see how you might be. "It is what comes from lordship, from rule. Most of his original court is gone. Korlat, Orfantal, Sorrit, Pra'iran. Vanished or dead. Thats doesnt make it any easier. Still, there are some who remain. Endest Silann for one."

I dont think we have enough info to know for certain, but any guesses rather this is the dragon Sorrit? Could what we thought of as a Dragon really be a Soletaken Tiste, stuck and impaled in dragon form? Does it matter?
I hope this hasnt been touched on before. If so I apologize. if it is a true naturla eleint, i am surprised we dont see Silanah metioned as a memeber of court as well. Of course, at the same time, I think the previous page is filled with Spinocks subterfuge...

This post has been edited by foolio: 19 October 2010 - 03:04 PM

[Vengeance]

Silanah from what I understand is a pure Dragon. So I doubt that she would be a member of the Tiste court.


I don't think that we have any word on whether Sorrit (the one who was impaled) was a real dragon or a soletaken.

[Illuyankas]

Could be a typo with Serrat.

[foolio]

Vengeance, on 19 October 2010 - 02:09 PM, said:

Silanah from what I understand is a pure Dragon. So I doubt that she would be a member of the Tiste court.

yeah, and thats kind of why I was speculating that Sorrit is not a true Eleint.(pure dragon, right?) Because we know Anomander likes his Silanah but she isnt mentioned. So if Silanah is excluded due to anti-Eleintism (just kidding folks) then I am assuming Sorrit should be different from Silanah. I know thats flimsy speculation, but we are waiting for a new book to come out, and I love finding things like this in re-reads.

[foolio]

Illuyankas, on 19 October 2010 - 02:17 PM, said:

Could be a typo with Serrat.

didnt even think about that, but that is a perfectly logical possibility.

[MTS]

I could have sworn I'd seen the name Prai'iran somewhere else, but I'm struggling to think of where at the moment.

[Abyss]

foolio, on 19 October 2010 - 02:21 PM, said:

Illuyankas, on 19 October 2010 - 02:17 PM, said:

Could be a typo with Serrat.

didnt even think about that, but that is a perfectly logical possibility.

'Serrat' typo was my thought too - the fact that four Andii dragons appear in MoI suggests she wasn't draconean, but she did run the Mage-Assassins for Rake and Rake expressed to Baruk that the M-As were sufficiently powerful that they could be a threat to him if he ever acted stupidly, whch suggests Serrat was sufficiently powerful to be one of Rake's inner circle.

That said, given that Silana hung with Rake for millenia, why shouldn't there be another eleint on the scene?

[Hetan]

Silannah was not a member of Rake's court.
She appeared at his side after the cleansing of Emurlahn and the closing of the gate.

Interesting though about Sorrit, if it is not a spelling mistake - Sorrit was murdered within the realm of Emurlahn, so that's a kind of connection.

[Abyss]

Hetan, on 19 October 2010 - 02:55 PM, said:

Silannah was not a member of Rake's court.
She appeared at his side after the cleansing of Emurlahn and the closing of the gate...

Depends on how you interpret 'court'. I took Spin's comment to be a reference to anyone who was a close friend, advisor or confidant of Rake's, as opposed to a formal ruling body sort of thing. Especially since it appeared that for the most part, the Moon's Spawn Andii followed Rake for lack of anything else to do, as opposed to a formal allegiance or fealty or whatever that a ruling 'court' might have.

Silannah and Rake clearly had some form of intimate relationship, the inter-species specifics of which we're all happier not dwelling on.

Korlat and Orfantal were part of his inner circle before they went off hunting Kallor.

Hence, there were already a bunch of draconics and at least one dragon hanging around raiding the fridge, drinking the beer and periodically going to war - why not Sorrit?


Then again, it could have been a typo...

[Bauchelain the Evil]

I always assumed it to be a typo for Serrat. After all Serrat was Rake's second before she died and Korlat took the place and her lack in that list is strange.

[foolio]

Abyss, on 19 October 2010 - 04:27 PM, said:

Hetan, on 19 October 2010 - 02:55 PM, said:

Silannah was not a member of Rake's court.
She appeared at his side after the cleansing of Emurlahn and the closing of the gate...

Depends on how you interpret 'court'. I took Spin's comment to be a reference to anyone who was a close friend, advisor or confidant of Rake's, as opposed to a formal ruling body sort of thing. Especially since it appeared that for the most part, the Moon's Spawn Andii followed Rake for lack of anything else to do, as opposed to a formal allegiance or fealty or whatever that a ruling 'court' might have.

Silannah and Rake clearly had some form of intimate relationship, the inter-species specifics of which we're all happier not dwelling on.

Korlat and Orfantal were part of his inner circle before they went off hunting Kallor.

Hence, there were already a bunch of draconics and at least one dragon hanging around raiding the fridge, drinking the beer and periodically going to war - why not Sorrit?


Then again, it could have been a typo...

I see references to Rake and Silanah knocking boots all the time, but i am ignorant as to where that comes from.....help?

and i was thinking of "court" in a lose way, like old trusted friends....his trusted posse if you will.

[Malaclypse]

Why is it controversial that Sorrit may have been a member of Rake's 'court', whether it was formal or informal? He had suckled from the bloody draconic teat before he could be said to have a 'court' and was at least as formidable as any true Eleint so what's the problem? Occam's Razor folks, it's almost certainly not a typo -from personal experience, that's not the sort of typo that Steve makes - in fact, typos as they are commonly defined do not enter into the equation with him, he makes incredibly few typos, but he does lose track of continuity issues from time to time - if he had meant Serrat, he would have caught the typo if that was what it was. I think the best way I can drive this point home is that he 'sees' what he writes, so he would have seen this ancient court as he was writing and then editing it, so Serrat versus Sorrit is a huge difference which he would not have missed.

Also, as Hetan pointed out, the timing of Silannah's appearance at Rake's side is documented, ruling her out as a member of this 'original court'.

Cheers.

This post has been edited by Malaclypse: 19 October 2010 - 06:20 PM

[Abyss]

foolio, on 19 October 2010 - 06:18 PM, said:

...I see references to Rake and Silanah knocking boots all the time, but i am ignorant as to where that comes from.....help?
...

iirc, Rake comment to Serrat in GotM after the rooftop fight against the assassin's guild and demon Pearl...

"I will seek Silannah's comfort for a while. AND SHAG HER ROTTEN BAY-BEE!"

...tho my recall may not be precise.

[foolio]

Abyss, on 19 October 2010 - 06:55 PM, said:

foolio, on 19 October 2010 - 06:18 PM, said:

...I see references to Rake and Silanah knocking boots all the time, but i am ignorant as to where that comes from.....help?
...

iirc, Rake comment to Serrat in GotM after the rooftop fight against the assassin's guild and demon Pearl...

"I will seek Silannah's comfort for a while. AND SHAG HER ROTTEN BAY-BEE!"

...tho my recall may not be precise.

god, you would think I would remember that....