[Blueiron]

Soletaken of D'ivers? so... [wild speculation] he has a set number of "shapes" arising from a bunch of different soul (they look the same because he got rid of the other wizards' bodies) and he switches between them. He's been working on being able to take the form of many of them at once, but still having the same, single body. This is so that he can access more power at once, because each soul can only access the warren that its original wizard could. This also explains why he has trouble accessing a large number of Warrens at once: he was still working on the whole multi-Soletaken thing. [/wild speculation]

Also, this sort of remind me of Trake's Legion in MoI, when they all semble together into a single tiger.

Bah, SE's novels are so mind bending that even my own speculation confuses me.

-Blueiron, noting the irony of saying "I still can't wait" for tCG

This post has been edited by Blueiron: 21 October 2010 - 11:11 PM

[Steve Halter]

Building on the possibility that QB is more along the d'ivers line of things than the soletaken line, raises an interesting possibility for whether he is still alive. If he is d'ivers and similar to some we saw in RotCG, he could have "sacrificed" one of the d'ivers forms to go out and chuck acorns at the short tails. Then, only that one was really blasted. The main QB is off doing something else.
We haven't directly seen QB do body splitting to this point, but it doesn't mean it couldn't be ...

[Mcflury]

Honoustly, I think QB just ran away from the FA and went to sacrifice some goats. Surely by now he's more desperate than he was when we first met him, so surely he went back to do the thing he knows best when desperate: sacrificing goats.

It actually makes sense... in a completely mad way

[SiriusL]

Mcflury, on 22 October 2010 - 07:04 PM, said:

Honoustly, I think QB just ran away from the FA and went to sacrifice some goats. Surely by now he's more desperate than he was when we first met him, so surely he went back to do the thing he knows best when desperate: sacrificing goats.

It actually makes sense... in a completely mad way

So you're saying goats are his d'ivers form, then?

I was wondering about acorns. I mean, we've never seen a human-plant shapeshifter, right?

[iRFNA]

I think the acorns were just minor links to some key players within the army, so that he could nudge them into doing what he said: go for the nodes. Those key players being people like fiddler and hedge, who automagically knew to go for the nodes and went about doing it.

[WhiskeyJackDaniels]

iRFNA, on 26 October 2010 - 02:19 AM, said:

I think the acorns were just minor links to some key players within the army, so that he could nudge them into doing what he said: go for the nodes. Those key players being people like fiddler and hedge, who automagically knew to go for the nodes and went about doing it.

Actually I think he set them off after the Nah'ruks that were carrying nodes, like search and destroy missiles.

[iRFNA]

WhiskeyJackDaniels, on 26 October 2010 - 04:11 AM, said:

iRFNA, on 26 October 2010 - 02:19 AM, said:

I think the acorns were just minor links to some key players within the army, so that he could nudge them into doing what he said: go for the nodes. Those key players being people like fiddler and hedge, who automagically knew to go for the nodes and went about doing it.

Actually I think he set them off after the Nah'ruks that were carrying nodes, like search and destroy missiles.

Are they ever shown doing anything but landing on the ground? Do any nodes start exploding without explanation?

Reread the section, notice how Fiddler is the first person besides quick ben to say anything about the nodes. Look at the order quick ben gives the acorns, then look at the first thing Fiddler says not half a page later.

[Sinisdar Toste]

i do remember nodes exploding for no reason. hedges recruits asked "whats that?" and hedge says "thats quick ben"

[iRFNA]

Sinisdar Toste, on 26 October 2010 - 05:17 AM, said:

i do remember nodes exploding for no reason. hedges recruits asked "whats that?" and hedge says "thats quick ben"

Quote

A concussion shook the very air, but it came from the Nah'ruk lines. A billowing cloud rose like a stain of spilled ink.
'Gods, what was that?'
Hedge's grin broadened. 'That, soldiers, was Quick Ben.'

Lightning arced out from hundreds of clubs, from multiple phalanxes to either side of the one he had attacked.
...
The first dozen or so ranks of the phalanx he'd struck were down, a few writhing or feebly struggling to rise with crushed limbs and snapped bones. Most were motionless, their bodies boiled from the inside out.

Doesn't sound much like targeted acorns smashing into nodes. Bodies boiled from the inside out?

This post has been edited by iRFNA: 26 October 2010 - 05:54 AM

[Sinisdar Toste]

iRFNA, on 26 October 2010 - 05:54 AM, said:

Sinisdar Toste, on 26 October 2010 - 05:17 AM, said:

i do remember nodes exploding for no reason. hedges recruits asked "whats that?" and hedge says "thats quick ben"

Quote

A concussion shook the very air, but it came from the Nah'ruk lines. A billowing cloud rose like a stain of spilled ink.
'Gods, what was that?'
Hedge's grin broadened. 'That, soldiers, was Quick Ben.'

Lightning arced out from hundreds of clubs, from multiple phalanxes to either side of the one he had attacked.
...
The first dozen or so ranks of the phalanx he'd struck were down, a few writhing or feebly struggling to rise with crushed limbs and snapped bones. Most were motionless, their bodies boiled from the inside out.

Doesn't sound much like targeted acorns smashing into nodes. Bodies boiled from the inside out?

well what evidence do we have? explosions and an assertion that quick ben has acted to bring them about. a few scenes earlier, quick sends out the acorns. we don't see what happens in between but there seems to me be a correlation. what he's responding to are the kep'rah lightning guns that charge up from the nodes. why bother blowing up individual nah'ruk when you can send in a sorcerous homing missile to blow up like thirty at once by busting the node?

edit: and boiling bodies wouldn't make a smoke stain that black

This post has been edited by Sinisdar Toste: 26 October 2010 - 04:07 PM

[WhiskeyJackDaniels]

Yea, I've gotta say its as much of an inference to say that he sent the acorns to instruct the Marines to target the nodes as it is to assume that the acorns he sent out acted like bombs. Except that there were random explosions that seem to explain nodes blowing up before the Bonehunters had a chance to start lobbing munitions at them.

This post has been edited by WhiskeyJackDaniels: 26 October 2010 - 09:33 PM

[The Farmer]

I have it on VERY good authority that when the crux and the final crunch arrives,Tehol turns up with a plate of sandwiches and they all live happily ever after.
What a splendind finale.
You heard it here first!

[The Farmer]

Cheeses & Tomato, before you ask.

[Sinisdar Toste]

The Farmer, on 26 November 2010 - 07:29 PM, said:

Cheeses & Tomato, before you ask.

no pastrami?

[The Farmer]

Pastrami would spoil the entire series!

[Excellence]

Finally finished the book!

Okay, I'm late, but I was taking my time and there's the usual massive amount of filler that has no interest. Just read the Nah'ruk battle... Ben was talking to his acron, yes, but not in the way they were alive. Just talking aloud. He was thinking aloud at that moment. The Barrowhunters were canny enough to guess the packs were energising the wands.

[Flawed]

Quick Ben is definitely a Diver's. He is a Dragon Diver's. End of………….

As an aside. One of his souls within him is actually Grizzin Farl.

Griz was never missing or dead. He was just playing at being mortal like whatsherface did in the first book and ended up being the round one. er…………….. Tattersail.

Now Griz is trapped within Ben. But he doesn’t have to give him his full power. He is an Elder God and does as he pleases. The situation that came about to get him within Quick is embarrassing enough but to have this mortal wield his powers also is too much.

Now. There have been times when QB has narrowly escaped death, times when his friends have died and times when he blatantly blagged his way round the world. But the fight with Iccy did stretch him. It stretched him in a way to almost merge all of his souls. Make all their power his own and not just a favour granted when they decide he can.

Now up to this point old Griz was only trickling his power here and there but this is a different situation. QB and ultimately Griz within him have a real chance to expire here with Iccy laying down the law.

So Griz opens himself fully, stretching Ben and changing him.

So QB is actually part Elder God.

Going back to mention about him being Mage of Dark. He will be. Possibly for a period of time. But it will only be one act. The names and beings behind the cards change frequently depending on the time and who is being manipulated by who.

I have said before that I do not think Ben is dead. He had time to look up then raise his hands. That is enough of him to get the hell out of dodge.

Now someone mentioned the big crater and a massive weapon that the lizards have, to get rid of him n such but that’s not true. It was just a lightening bolt from one of their sky keeps. The same bolts they sent at Iccys keep just down to the ground. I figure they needed overkill to kill what was overly killing their phalanxes as easily as he did.

One point I may add is that the acorns he sent out were little bits of him. Parts of his souls. One for each. but that’s speculation I suppose

So where is QB? he will turn up on Twighlights shore. He will have a chat with Mother Dark. She will see one of her children inside him ( Griz and the Andii ). She will let QB fight in her name and then take her army and help join the fight in the last stages.

QB is one of my fave characters. He is an enigma and too much has been invested in his mystery for him to be gone. Wishful thinking I know but we all need hope.

Back to the Diver's part. One of his Souls was a soletaken. I think it was the Part Andii person. I also kind of remember it being mentioned that the Part Andii soletaken was a Wolf ??

I don’t remember. To many years have passed. Anyhow. I think that Quick will change into either a 12 headed dragon because Griz is blatantly going to be a Elient also like some of the other Elders in some form or another. Or a 12 tailed Wolf and that’s why he was greeted as brother by the Perish.

I'm exhausted now.

[Ceda Cicero]

Flawed, on 29 November 2010 - 11:00 AM, said:

Quick Ben is definitely a Diver's. He is a Dragon Diver's. End of………….

As an aside. One of his souls within him is actually Grizzin Farl.

Griz was never missing or dead. He was just playing at being mortal like whatsherface did in the first book and ended up being the round one. er…………….. Tattersail.

Now Griz is trapped within Ben. But he doesn't have to give him his full power. He is an Elder God and does as he pleases. The situation that came about to get him within Quick is embarrassing enough but to have this mortal wield his powers also is too much.

Now. There have been times when QB has narrowly escaped death, times when his friends have died and times when he blatantly blagged his way round the world. But the fight with Iccy did stretch him. It stretched him in a way to almost merge all of his souls. Make all their power his own and not just a favour granted when they decide he can.

Now up to this point old Griz was only trickling his power here and there but this is a different situation. QB and ultimately Griz within him have a real chance to expire here with Iccy laying down the law.

So Griz opens himself fully, stretching Ben and changing him.

So QB is actually part Elder God.

Going back to mention about him being Mage of Dark. He will be. Possibly for a period of time. But it will only be one act. The names and beings behind the cards change frequently depending on the time and who is being manipulated by who.

I have said before that I do not think Ben is dead. He had time to look up then raise his hands. That is enough of him to get the hell out of dodge.

Now someone mentioned the big crater and a massive weapon that the lizards have, to get rid of him n such but that's not true. It was just a lightening bolt from one of their sky keeps. The same bolts they sent at Iccys keep just down to the ground. I figure they needed overkill to kill what was overly killing their phalanxes as easily as he did.

One point I may add is that the acorns he sent out were little bits of him. Parts of his souls. One for each. but that's speculation I suppose

So where is QB? he will turn up on Twighlights shore. He will have a chat with Mother Dark. She will see one of her children inside him ( Griz and the Andii ). She will let QB fight in her name and then take her army and help join the fight in the last stages.

QB is one of my fave characters. He is an enigma and too much has been invested in his mystery for him to be gone. Wishful thinking I know but we all need hope.

Back to the Diver's part. One of his Souls was a soletaken. I think it was the Part Andii person. I also kind of remember it being mentioned that the Part Andii soletaken was a Wolf ??

I don't remember. To many years have passed. Anyhow. I think that Quick will change into either a 12 headed dragon because Griz is blatantly going to be a Elient also like some of the other Elders in some form or another. Or a 12 tailed Wolf and that's why he was greeted as brother by the Perish.

I'm exhausted now.

Maybe it's wishful thinking on my part but I really hope the Grizzin Farl mystery is in no way tied to Quick, or at least to the mystery of his "missing" souls. There are definitely Ascendant qualities to QB that will almost certainly be unveiled in tCG, but one of the ongoing themes of his character is that he's an incredibly complex, incredibly brilliant underdog type that nearly always comes through because he knows how to keep his cards close. I for one will be disappointed if Quick's secret turns out to be something as simple as "I've been toting around an Elder God who knows how to take discretion to the extreme all this time and now BOOM here he is."

That said, I am personally of the opinion that QB is somehow crucially linked to Andarist, and as such think it highly probable that when we next see him he'll be turning up in KG with the Shake. I don't have the quote fu to back this up right now, but I know I'm not alone in this theory, so maybe someone will jump on board. This would, however, explain why, when Quick drew the Magus of Dark, one of his first musings to himself was "There was a throne once..." It would also explain why in GotM, when QB meets Hairlock on the Spar of the Andii in Chaos, he tells Hairlock "I've been here before." The mystery of how/why Andarist voluntarily gave up a substantial portion (all?) of his power would also be wrapped up in this.

[MillionSpots]

Um, a question?

I did a reread of DG and realized that Quick Ben knew a lot about the Azath; Pust and Mappo did not know about the portals in the Azath that would make possible instantaneous travel (correct me if I'm wrong) and were surprised at what Fiddler told them.
Now there are two souls in him whose identities we don't know. I was wondering if it would not be impossible for one (or both) of those to be Nameless Ones? Because they are, well, nameless. Which may explain his knowledge as well as the poem QB wrote as Adaephon, haha.

Either that, or QB has walked into an Azath House one day and met Gothos, who told him things he ought to know. Apparently they met sometime in the past. If I recall, QB said something about Gothos knowing who he really was... I'm kinda hoping QB wouldn't turn out to be hoarding powerful gods' souls in his body. That would disappoint me.

[ShadowRaven]

MillionSpots, on 02 December 2010 - 06:48 AM, said:

Um, a question?

I did a reread of DG and realized that Quick Ben knew a lot about the Azath; Pust and Mappo did not know about the portals in the Azath that would make possible instantaneous travel (correct me if I'm wrong) and were surprised at what Fiddler told them.
Now there are two souls in him whose identities we don't know. I was wondering if it would not be impossible for one (or both) of those to be Nameless Ones? Because they are, well, nameless. Which may explain his knowledge as well as the poem QB wrote as Adaephon, haha.

Either that, or QB has walked into an Azath House one day and met Gothos, who told him things he ought to know. Apparently they met sometime in the past. If I recall, QB said something about Gothos knowing who he really was... I'm kinda hoping QB wouldn't turn out to be hoarding powerful gods' souls in his body. That would disappoint me.

I definitely like this Nameless One idea, it would certainly explain a few things. One of QB's souls was confirmed to be a Jhag in MoI so that could explain the meeting Gothos part. However, his extensive knowledge of the Azath, and Tremorlor especially, could also come from the fact that another one his souls was a known 7C scholar.

Although I don't really want one of the other souls to turn out to be an EG, here's another crazy theory: what if one is souls is actually Father Light that got soulshifted into him when he was strolling around in a human disguise akin to Sister of Cold Nights/Nightchill and Aranatha? Here's a few points that could support it:

- This could certainly explain why he was careful around Rake, Rake probably wasn't happy about FL causing the breaching of Darkness
- It would explain his disbelief at being assigned as Magus of Dark in DoD, more so than if the soul was Grizzin Farl
- Could also explain his thoughts about him being the only one capable of opposing Draconus and Draconus knowing "who he is"?
- Gods (at least non-Elders) can be killed when they manifest in a "true" physical form (e.g. Fener, Hood). It could explain QB's unwillingness to use the direct approach at times: if Father Light was truly destroyed who knows what would happen to the universe itself?
- IIRC, his "reveal more of myself than I want to" comments mostly started surfacing later in the series when Aranatha was introduced and Mother Dark's return was drawing closer. MD and FL are referred to being linked in a sense, for example the comments in TtH about them both having to turn away.