[worry]

The Malazan Book of the Fallen at its surface seems to refer to those who fall in battle, especially those in the Malazan imperial army. But to how many other strands of the story can the title be applied? And what may it hint at?

There's the Bridgeburners in particular, who fell at Pale and at Coral, and yet experienced something pretty extraordinary in their group ascension.
There's the army of the dead who fight inside Dragnipur, and the dead inside Hood's Realm. Plenty of the dead show a surprising amount of agency, and interest in the affairs of the world(s).
There's the individual heroes and villains who have fallen along the way, like Trull, and Itkovian, and Beak, and Felisin, and Coltaine, and Duiker, and Kalam, and Pearl, and Murillio, Redmask, Rhulad, Toc the Younger, and in a way, Tool. The Bonehunters. There's definitely a strong elegiac, tragic aspect to the title.
There's the fall of civilizations, the First Empires, Kallor's empire. There's Kallor himself, a high king fallen from grace. The Malazan Empire itself has fallen from its heights, and perhaps continues to do so. The Old Guard have certainly fallen by the wayside. And what of Lether and Kolanse?
And speaking of falls from grace, Anomander Rake and the Tiste Andii, who've fallen in the eyes of Mother Dark. There are apparent parallels in the Tiste Liosan despite their haughty demeanor, and the Tiste Edur perhaps worst of all. At least the most demeaning.
There's the races of Wu who each have fallen to their successors. Look how far the KCCM and Jaghut have fallen, despite their respective technological genius. Not to mention the TTT, who've been windblown, scattered, and diluted. Karsa understands how far they've fallen.
The T'lan Imass have similarly fallen, but in their own way, and by their own choice. They've fallen away from their humanity. One might say the same for some of the Crimson Guard.
There's the fall of the Elder Gods to their upstart replacements, and some of them haven't taken so kindly to this. Mael has set up his own museum to fallen gods. Who knows what Olar Ethil has done to herself. Fener isn't Elder, but he was pulled down just as well.
The Dragons, of course, are few and far between these days. Tiam has fallen time and again, and is currently a missing piece on the board. Many are dead, or somehow trapped upon the earth. A pretty awful fall for such (traditionally) majestic high fliers.
Kellanved and Dancer literally fell from a tower in their plans for ascension.
The jade statues have fallen to earth.
And of course the fallen one himself, the Crippled God.

The name is just apt beyond measure, I've found. What do you think? Does it encompass any or all of these things? Did I miss anything, subtle or obvious?

[Aptorian]

Well the obvious would be that, as far as I recall, the name "Book of the Fallen" is borrowed from a similar book, a record of fallen soldiers that Napoleon kept.

[The Tyrant Lizard]

I always thought it came from a the Book of the Dead from WW2. The name suggests it's a list of Malazan CoW, but it might have something to do with the Fallen God.

[worry]

Well, I do think it's meant to be taken pretty directly like that, at least initially, but I also think there is more to it than that. The meaning of the title expands with every story told (and the wrinkles in history), and I think even some of the punning and double-meaning on "fallen" is deliberate (especially as it relates to Rake, the EGs, the BBs, ST/Cots, and The Crippled God). That bit of info about Napoleon is cool though, I hadn't heard that before.

[Hood's Legacy]

worrywort, on 03 June 2010 - 09:07 AM, said:

Well, I do think it's meant to be taken pretty directly like that, at least initially, but I also think there is more to it than that. The meaning of the title expands with every story told (and the wrinkles in history), and I think even some of the punning and double-meaning on "fallen" is deliberate (especially as it relates to Rake, the EGs, the BBs, ST/Cots, and The Crippled God). That bit of info about Napoleon is cool though, I hadn't heard that before.

Thanks to Apt, for the Napolean part. However, more than war records, I would go with what Worry's stating.. It seems that SE is referring to cultures and civilisations that have fallen (as in history). I look at the books as a fantasy re-imagining of our (the human race's history) as I see many similarities in the events in SE's and in history books. The entire series could be more like an History textbook (though SE speaks about more than just History in his books).

[haroos]

worrywort, on 03 June 2010 - 06:49 AM, said:

The Malazan Book of the Fallen at its surface seems to refer to those who fall in battle, especially those in the Malazan imperial army. But to how many other strands of the story can the title be applied? And what may it hint at?

There's the Bridgeburners in particular, who fell at Pale and at Coral, and yet experienced something pretty extraordinary in their group ascension.
There's the army of the dead who fight inside Dragnipur, and the dead inside Hood's Realm. Plenty of the dead show a surprising amount of agency, and interest in the affairs of the world(s).
There's the individual heroes and villains who have fallen along the way, like Trull, and Itkovian, and Beak, and Felisin, and Coltaine, and Duiker, and Kalam, and Pearl, and Murillio, Redmask, Rhulad, Toc the Younger, and in a way, Tool. The Bonehunters. There's definitely a strong elegiac, tragic aspect to the title.
There's the fall of civilizations, the First Empires, Kallor's empire. There's Kallor himself, a high king fallen from grace. The Malazan Empire itself has fallen from its heights, and perhaps continues to do so. The Old Guard have certainly fallen by the wayside. And what of Lether and Kolanse?
And speaking of falls from grace, Anomander Rake and the Tiste Andii, who've fallen in the eyes of Mother Dark. There are apparent parallels in the Tiste Liosan despite their haughty demeanor, and the Tiste Edur perhaps worst of all. At least the most demeaning.
There's the races of Wu who each have fallen to their successors. Look how far the KCCM and Jaghut have fallen, despite their respective technological genius. Not to mention the TTT, who've been windblown, scattered, and diluted. Karsa understands how far they've fallen.
The T'lan Imass have similarly fallen, but in their own way, and by their own choice. They've fallen away from their humanity. One might say the same for some of the Crimson Guard.
There's the fall of the Elder Gods to their upstart replacements, and some of them haven't taken so kindly to this. Mael has set up his own museum to fallen gods. Who knows what Olar Ethil has done to herself. Fener isn't Elder, but he was pulled down just as well.
The Dragons, of course, are few and far between these days. Tiam has fallen time and again, and is currently a missing piece on the board. Many are dead, or somehow trapped upon the earth. A pretty awful fall for such (traditionally) majestic high fliers.
Kellanved and Dancer literally fell from a tower in their plans for ascension.
The jade statues have fallen to earth.
And of course the fallen one himself, the Crippled God.

The name is just apt beyond measure, I've found. What do you think? Does it encompass any or all of these things? Did I miss anything, subtle or obvious?

i always assumed the fallen refered to the crippled god.
i know the first book starts with a poem dedicated to the fallen malazan soldiers, but the CG is the only one repeatedly refered to as THE FALLEN ONE.
but i like ambiguity.

[Ulrik]

IMO, fallen firtly referred to fallen soldiers, but in series, so far, it reaches beyond...for me is fall of cultures or civilisations pretty strong motive in MBoF and is equal to importancy of fallen soldiers, many nameless ones, or named ones.

[The Seguleh 46th]

Death death everywhere! Aaahhhh! Yea, i always figured it referred to TCG, but i really liked the original post. Fallen referring to everything is pretty apt in my estimate. Could throw in Hood, for good measure. The great thing about this series though, at least in reference to "Fallen" theme, is the Ascensions to complement it. (i need to start smoking again!)

[Tyrant]

Whilst I'm sure allusions to military casualty lists and the Crippled God would not be admonished by Erikson and they could both fit quite nicely, I think 'Malazan Book of the Fallen' is quite simply a poignant reminder, or indeed a warning, that ultimately these books are about loss and sacrifice and that the overarching theme is one of WAR; war between nations and civilisations, between good and evil, mortals and Gods, light and dark...and that with war there comes the one inescapable truth; that people will die, that characters of strength and fortitude, of courage and valour will fall, for that is the nature of war.

[worry]

I don't disagree with that, but I think there's decidedly more to the word "fallen" than relates to mere death. I do appreciate that you mention good and evil; even as SE presents a vast grey area, I don't think he's abandoned the notions of "good" and "evil" all together. But it's acts that are good and evil, and people who choose and/or succumb. A lot of characters in this story fall long before they die, or fall without dying at all. On SE's latest blog post he said the story was about compassion, and I think that rings true in just about every storyline. From the Imass to the Jaghut, from Whiskeyjack to Kallor, from Trull to Rhulad. War is hell, vengeance is stupid, power corrupts, and when the worst is brought out of you, you are damaged, even if you're victorious. Nobody's born a monster, but monstrous acts do create monsters out of people (eg the Pannion Seer, Anaster, Dassem). That doesn't mean you tolerate tyrants, but you can feel compassion even as you stop them. I mentioned some who've fallen morally, so to speak, in the OP, but Itkovian and Beak are some of the major keys to what SE is getting at, I think, for those who've died without falling.

[Tattersail_]

maybe how the fallen inspire those that are left standing? this could be simple, but we know it is not. it is to vast and complex for a simple answer.

[worry]

Yah, I like that idea.