[Path-Shaper]

I'll try to resolve this night... let's see if everyone's PM is there.

~Dinivan

[Path-Shaper]

Good...

told Ruse that Mockra is Cabal.
asked Eloth whether he wants to take up the coin. (waiting for answer)
told Rashan that Osseric protected himself.
told Meanas that Rashan is Sanya.

Kashan dies, weather goes one down.

I'm waiting a bit for Eloth's answer before posting the scene.

[Path-Shaper]

Eloth refused to take the coin, I notified Ampelas.

He wants to know whether he can disclose the recruitment attempt to his partner/on thread. I think he should be able to do both, but please confirm, Obdi.

~Dinivan

[drinksinbars]

Sir Thursday, on 25 November 2009 - 01:22 AM, said:

I think the one problem with this game is the lack of obvious goal for the RIs - if you've got a role/faction, you've got some kind of insight into the mechanics of the game, but as RI you get nothing. You really need something to aim at to counteract the boredom that comes from perpetually stumbling around in the darkness.

In fact, I feel this is a major problem in general with high TMDI games - they're only really fun if you've got a good role, otherwise you miss out on a large proportion of the fun going on behind the scenes. Whereas with lower TMDI games, it's not such a problem as there are fewer NAs going through that you're missing out on.


Sir Thursday

i think i sent obdia few rather colourful pms to that effect and posted enough about it on thread too. Just because a game has a high tmdi it shouldnt be played blind. its definitely not as much fun for those playing and people never really try to form strategies or trick people if they dont have aclear idea of the games goals.

[Gavin]

Yeah agree with you there Dibsy on that one. I think thats one of the things that made Spycraft so successful was everyone had a role and everyone was in on some of the action. And we could see all the other action happening.

Be interested to see how Ruse plays this, he must know everyone wants him dead so he needs a credible reveal or to build a case. Which there hasn't been a lot of case building so far this game.

D'riss can't really win it from here, so if they give him a coin he may jump at it, that could be exciting as well.

What does the coin do with Bianca getting it Odbi?

[Bent]

I dint have so much issue with being roleless as I did not having any idea what I was up against. sure 4 known factions, but the added mechanics and the fact that as a roleless inno my job was - dont die, made it more difficult to get into and keep up with the game. Its really not the set-up that I question, more the - how do RI win - and there never was clarification on the majority rules issue. Thats kind of important.

[Path-Shaper]

Gavin, on 25 November 2009 - 01:01 PM, said:

Yeah agree with you there Dibsy on that one. I think thats one of the things that made Spycraft so successful was everyone had a role and everyone was in on some of the action. And we could see all the other action happening.

Be interested to see how Ruse plays this, he must know everyone wants him dead so he needs a credible reveal or to build a case. Which there hasn't been a lot of case building so far this game.

D'riss can't really win it from here, so if they give him a coin he may jump at it, that could be exciting as well.

What does the coin do with Bianca getting it Odbi?

Interesting enough, Ampelas has considered recruiting D'riss this night, but now wants to kill Eloth instead. If D'riss accepted, he'd gain 3 powerlevel, though I have no idea what would happen to his abilities.

And so far Ruse is quite unlynchable. Nobody really throws heat at him, I'd say he's quite secure at the moment. (and his powerlevel also ensures a fair share of safety)

[Sir Thursday]

What the teams need to do to win:

Winter Sidhe: Dead
Summer Sidhe: Kill Mockra and Eloth and push the weather to +10
Vampires: Kill Harry, then get Gamelon to push the weather to +10
Cabal: Kill Ruse to win and avoid being recruited.
Denarians: Kill Ruse to win.
Harrys: Kill Mockra, Eloth and Ampelas to win.
Knights: Kill Ampelas, then get Gamelon to push the weather to -5.

The only way that The Knights, Vampires or Summer Sidhe have any chance at all is if D'riss manages to recruit one of the Cabal. And even then I think we can pretty much guarantee that the the Vampires and the Sidhe are out of it.


Seems to me as though the Winter and Summer queens needed to have a lot more control over the weather - say +2 per night. As it is, the Cabal has far more control than them, making it impossible for them to realistically fulfill their "Kill the other queen then crank up the weather" VC without the Cabal's help. It also seems like the Vampires are in a horribly weak position as far as achieving their VCs are concerned, since if (as happened in this game) the Cabal aim to make it colder, they're pretty much screwed over. I don't really see how you can expect a faction to fulfill a weather-related VC without any ability to manipulate the weather in any way...


Sir Thursday

[Dinivan]

Which is why I postulated a more indirect system of weather controll when I was wildly speculating.

As far as I can see it'll be a rundown between Harry and the Denarians. (Eloth get's killed by Ampelas, Ruse knows Mockra is cabal, so Cabal is toast. The others are out of play once Gamelon is dead - which is likely)

D'riss has a chance if he is recruited. As a vampire faction I don't see any chance (how should he now reach +10? impossible now. With a lucky early cabal recruit or less bad luck with the subject vampires dying it would have been possible to gain enough leverage. But as the situation right now is, I don't see a chance)

This post has been edited by Dinivan: 25 November 2009 - 01:54 PM

[Gavin]

Well if Amp kills Eloth and Mockra gets lynched, then demons can't win either as they need to get the weather to -10 and that can no longer happen. I guess it will be a Dresden win if he gets Gamelon to change the weather.

[Dinivan]

true enough. Well, Dresden doesn't need to do anything about the wheather, it's enough if the cabal is dead and another Denarian dies and either he or Rashan gets the coin. ( being on the denarians lynch train would be enough)

this means, Dresden faction will most likely win, while Denarians might be able to force a draw through numbers (if eleminating every other faction is no way to win this)

[Gavin]

Ahh Dresden doesn't need the weather at -5 like the Knights? Well then yeah they're in the box seat at this point. He just needs to get Mockra lynched then without poking his head up and saying everyone he's Dresden. Actually if both Bianca and Amp target him for a kill I imagine he'd die?

[Dinivan]

probably. Though the only instance where banding together on a kill worked was when the denarians worked together to kill Michael. No idea if members of different factions can work together just as well, though it would be reasonable that they'd do so when they target him at the same time.

but so far he's not a very high target on anyone's list.

ETA: His last post is veeeeerrrrry subtle

This post has been edited by Dinivan: 25 November 2009 - 02:29 PM

[Gavin]

That is subtle and doesn't look anything like he did a find at night on Mockra at all. Will be interested to see how this plays out. Mockra and Eloth might be enough to sway the lynch away unless Ruse does something special.

[Sir Thursday]

Gavin, on 25 November 2009 - 02:50 PM, said:

That is subtle and doesn't look anything like he did a find at night on Mockra at all. Will be interested to see how this plays out. Mockra and Eloth might be enough to sway the lynch away unless Ruse does something special.

Depends on how hard Ruse pushes. Remember, there are a lot of people gunning for him (although I don't know if he knows that), so it might suit his purposes not to push too hard if it doesn't look like people got his oh so subtle hint. I guess we'll see.

Sir Thursday

[Path-Shaper]

here is a snippet of a post from Eloth:

Eloth, on 25 November 2009 - 07:17 PM, said:

The thing is (to use a poker analogy), in a faction game we all keep all cards close to the chest, including those of us looking for recruitment, if only to keep all directions open once we are recruited, rather than having to make a 180 degree turn and be outed straightaway.

Moreover, things change. A deal one refused yesterday, that same person may take up today - it all depends on the way the game turns out and how opinions change, or on how they perceive the playing field.

The funny bit is that Eloth has put this out as a (fake) invitation to try another recruitment attempt on him. Ampelas is now actively trying to figure out if it is such an invitation

I (Dinivan) have given Eloth permission to tell his partner about the recruitment attempt. If that's against the rules, all blame lies with me.

[Path-Shaper]

added a few night actions.

So, as I see it:

Ruse assaults Mockra - drives him off (10 is not double of 7), meaning that Mockras NA fails.
D'riss recruits Mockra (8>7, Cabal is human, goes through)

yeesh this is complicated.

[alt146]

Mockra getting recuited is going to make this game insanely interesting - Mockra's win condition will suddenly shift to the other end of the scale from where it was before, making it damn near impossible for him to win. And Eloth will have to realise Mockra's been recruited and lynch him else he will lose. Although since Ruse knows Mockra is in the cabal that is likely anyway. The denarians are propably are probably neck and neck with Harry to get a win, if Amp starts to post more they have a good chance of winning.

[Path-Shaper]

yes it will be. Though i don't see the denarians winning unless they recruit Eloth. (they need the extreme wheather)

and if mockra is recruited, he'll still have the wheather changing ability + feed + investigate? does his powerlevel get up? he still can talk with Eloth?

To the point: Ampelas is now gunning for Ruse. Should fail though, 'cause they have equal powerlevel. (though how could nicodemus be killed by harry, as the first post suggests? harry needs twice his powerlevel to kill.)


and olar ethil requested a modkill. Could you deal with this (and an eventual freeze), obdi? I will do it in some hours, if you aren't around (thanksgiving and stuff), but I'm a bit anxious about deciding things as I'm not even official co-mod.

~Dinivan

[Sir Thursday]

With D'riss recruiting Mockra, that puts the Knights back into the frame, since it means the weather might actually get back to within acceptable parameters for them to win. They only have to lynch Ampelas, remember...


Sir Thursday