[Battalion]

Thought we could try to create a sporting hall of fame, starting with the boxers of thr world. I've made a list, but if any one thinks I've left someone out, we can always count votes of that person too.

I'd be interested to see peoples choices.

I voted for Iron Mike because of his destructive power and raw aggression earily in his career.

This post has been edited by Grief: 22 September 2009 - 03:56 PM

[Aptorian]

Could you edit the poll to include an "other" option?

You should always leave an opening for people, because I don't want to vote for my second favorite choice just because I can't vote for anything else.

The Answer is of course Mikkel Kessler

[amphibian]

Sugar Ray Robinson is the GOAT for me. Ali is second. Not quite heresy, as you'd be surprised how many people just go "Yeah, I can see that."

[masan's saddle]

 Aptorian, on 22 September 2009 - 01:59 PM, said:

Could you edit the poll to include an "other" option?

You should always leave an opening for people, because I don't want to vote for my second favorite choice just because I can't vote for anything else.

The Answer is of course Mikkel Kessler

Ha Ha !

I'm glad you put a smilie on there Apt cos I seem to remember watching Joe Calzaghe rearrange Kessler's face for him a couple of years ago.

In recent years you would be hard pushed to find a better pound for pound fighter than Calzaghe. Unbeaten ( in 46 I think) Worldchampion for 10 years he beat everybody in his class, changing weight divisions a few times. Kessler, Lacey, Eubank, Woodhall, Bernard Hopkins and Roy Jones Jr, he out outboxed all of them. After beating Jones he was widely regarded as the best British boxer ever.

Granted he didn't have the massive knockout punch of some of his contemporaries and got tagged a few times in later fights. But in terms of technique and durability, as far as super middleweights go from the last 10-15 years, he was peerless.

There are a few other notables missing from the list IMO that would be worth a mention. Lennox Lewis, Barrera and Kostya Tzu to name a few.

That said though Ali was the best.

[Bauchelain the Evil]

Cassius Clay, now known as Muhummad Alì, is hands down the greates boxer ever.
To quote him: "Floats like a butterfly, stings like a be".

[Sindriss]

Calzaghe just had a lucky day against Kessler. He didn't outbox him that much.

Offtopic: But how about making Hall of Fame for the sport achievements of the people using the board? I mean, yes we read books but I bet that a lot of people in here have some great stories and achievements. Otherwise I got some:)

[Aptorian]

 Sindriss, on 22 September 2009 - 05:19 PM, said:

Calzaghe just had a lucky day against Kessler. He didn't outbox him that much.

I really like Kessler but lets be honest, from about the 4 round in, Kessler no longer had a leg to stand on. Calzaghe outboxed him and looked good doing it, and that's despite the fact that Kessler is normally the one that makes it look easy.

I chalk it down to Calzaghe being the more seasoned veteran. In another 5 years, if Kessler hasn't stopped because of his injuries, he will be the better boxer. I can't wait to see how he progresses in the upcoming Super Six matches.

[Macros]

what, no Balboa? he beat Creed man!

[Slow Ben]

I pity the fool who pick Balboa!





And the answer is Ali.

[Aptorian]

Oh man. This thread is only a few steps away from going into full scale "Tyson vs Ali" fanboy rage.

(The answer is Tyson)

[Macros]

Tyson's a thug
Ali was good but not the greatest
Ivan drago would be a good shout but iron fists put him down everytime.

Its got to be Marciano

[Binder of Demons]

 masan, on 22 September 2009 - 03:37 PM, said:

Ha Ha !

I'm glad you put a smilie on there Apt cos I seem to remember watching Joe Calzaghe rearrange Kessler's face for him a couple of years ago.

In recent years you would be hard pushed to find a better pound for pound fighter than Calzaghe. Unbeaten ( in 46 I think) Worldchampion for 10 years he beat everybody in his class, changing weight divisions a few times. Kessler, Lacey, Eubank, Woodhall, Bernard Hopkins and Roy Jones Jr, he out outboxed all of them. After beating Jones he was widely regarded as the best British boxer ever.

Granted he didn't have the massive knockout punch of some of his contemporaries and got tagged a few times in later fights. But in terms of technique and durability, as far as super middleweights go from the last 10-15 years, he was peerless.

There are a few other notables missing from the list IMO that would be worth a mention. Lennox Lewis, Barrera and Kostya Tzu to name a few.

That said though Ali was the best.

I know you could say this for a lot of boxers, but despite how good Calzaghe was, i honestly think he was lucky to have arrived on the British scene when he did. If he had come on the scene say 5 years earlier and had to fight the likes of Eubank, Collins and Benn when they still had legs, then i think he would have lost at least once, probably twice and maybe 3 times.
Benn i'd have given a punchers chance, but i think Calzaghe would have found his soft chin, especially since he could take a fair punch himself.

Collins i'd have put money on, since he had a head like a stone, and could have pressured Calzaghe for the entire fight, and would have eventually ground him down, like he did to Eubank. I know Calzaghe called out Collins at one point, but financially at the time it made no sense for Collins since he was trying to get the huge money fight with Roy Jones Jr. Collins was a strange guy who completely redefined himself as a boxer after losing a couple of dodgy world title decisions. Out went the skilled counterpunching, and in came the over the top pressure fighter who just ground down opponents. Much uglier in terms of technique, but it scored better with the judges and suddenly he managed to win world titles at middleweight and then super-middle.

Considering how hard Calzaghe had to work to beat an aged Eubank, i don't think he could have come close to beating Eubank in his prime. The saddest fact of Eubank's career is that he was never the same boxer after he fought Michael Watson. Gone was the clinical counter puncher who pounded his opponents into submission when he saw a weakness. Instead he seemed content to just outpoint his opponents. I remember him asking referees to stop fights several times rather than continue to hammer the guy into the canvas. And yet he still ruled the super middleweight division until Collins got into his head with the hypnosis thing, and beat him in a really tight match (and then a rematch).

I have a lot of respect for Calzaghe, especially considering what he managed late in his career, but unfortunately for me, the biggest names on his resume were all well past their prime when he fought them.


As for the hall of fame list, i'd go with Sugar Ray Robinson for his skills, endurance, and his ability to move up and down through the divisions. Followed by Ali for the way he redefined the sport (for good or bad). Also Ali's longevity is amazing considering the enforced absence, and the quality of opponents at the time, that you couldn't duck either. When you consider that Foreman could be out of boxing for 10 years and still manage to win a world title (of sorts) against Tysons contemporaries, then i tihnk that puts things in persepctive.

Tyson was a freak early in his career, and had he managed to retain some bit of sanity then he might have ended up in the discussion. But the loss of his mentor Cus D'Amato early on, and even guys like Teddy Atlas who were willing to push him, sadly meant that he never really fulfilled his potential (and still he managed to become one of the most feared boxers ever!).

It is worth pointing out that several of the people on the list, actually stated that they felt Robinson was the greatest of all time (and that includes Ali).

[Cold Iron]

Kostya

[Bhurnae]

No brainer. Ali, with Sugar Ray Robinson a close second and probably Joe Louis third. Tyson was awesome when he first came on the scene. His raw power and aggression combined with that uppercut won most of his early fights. He had a great knowledge of the history of boxing. I used to have an old VHS of Ali, Foreman, Frazier et al. Foreman said he near shit himself at the power when Ali first hit him.

This post has been edited by Bhurnae: 23 September 2009 - 08:48 AM

[The Tyrant Lizard]

I went for marciano. 49 fights 49 wins 43 KOs. He might not have been the best boxer but the stats speak for themselves. And being the heavyweight champion is cooler than being the super middle weight so he pwns Calzaghe.

I was gonna vote for Tommy Morrison but I got no respect for people who take it to the street.

[masan's saddle]

@ BOD I agree with some of what you are saying. Calzaghe was arguably "protected" when he was younger, however he wanted to fight Jones and Hopkins when they were in there prime, "they" didn't want to risk it. It is an unfortunate facet of more modern boxing that promoters and purses play such amassive role. Potentially, some of the most juciest fights didnt happen because of promoters wanting to ride a potential cash cow, I mean come on, my nan could have beaten Audley Harrison.

As for Calzaghe fighting Benn, Eubank and Collins ? You can only fight what's infront of you. He did beat Eubank, albeit not the swaggering, monocled, pre-Watson counter puncher. I'll stand by what I said earlier that Calzaghe was technically superior although out of the 3 Eubank would have been the closest. I reckon he would have pitter pattered Benn into submission by the 9th or 10th ( a Lucky Benn haymaker notwithstanding !) and danced Collins to a points decision. I agree with what you said about Collins, he was an awesome sight in full flow and on his day had the potential to beat anybody.

As for how Calzaghe would have got on against Leonard or Hagler ? I don't know. That's the problem with the question "whose the greatest ?" there are too many variables. You have to take into account weight division, era, number of rounds, records, contemporary opinions, overall global impact..., etc etc. It's a tough one, I originally went with Ali and then remembered Robinson's acheivements, not to mention how many rounds Joe Louis would have to go through for each of his defences...., arghh!

Sindriss, you must have been watching a different fight to me. Everyone was raving about how good the younger, faster, harder hitting Kessler was, as they did with Jeff Lacey. Calzaghe technically dismantled the both of them whilst also managing to make them look stupid and in the case of Lacey in particular, rough them up. It was a comprehensive victory, not luck.

[Battalion]

 new-1.jpg (42.14K)
Number of downloads: 5

PROOF! Tyson is a goat!

EDIT: This picture has not been tampered with.

This post has been edited by Battalion: 24 September 2009 - 03:21 PM

[Bhurnae]

Cooper has changed a bit...........

[Battalion]

What ever do you mean?

[Bhurnae]