[Shadowperch]

Just musing about Tiste Liosan and L'oric. I'm going through a re read of TTH and the new stuff we have learnt about the origins of the Andii makes me think the future Drake trilogy will be epic. But will there be any chance of a clash between Andii and Liosan post TTH? If so perhaps there will be a battle between L'oric and Nemander. The Sons taking up the fathers arguments (history repeating itself possibly).

Thinking about L'oric makes me wonder about the Osric and Spite relationship-is she L'orics mother? If yes, Id expect L'oric to be much more powerful than he seems to be. could be another Trull not realising how strong he is- seemed to have a major inferiority complex from what I remember of HOC.

the Tiste in my opinion set this series up on high. Especially the distinct characterisation of racial traits. -Moody Deep Andii, Secretive Self obssessed Edur and over confident head strong Liosan

[Aptorian]

L'oric is the most pathetic ascendant ever. On the other hand I am not sure Nimander is an ascendant? Besides our knowledge of his heritage, do we have any indication he is an ascendant?

L'oric and Nimander fighting would be the most emo and saddest battle ever, endless internal monologues of "Oooh, what if I'm not good enough, nobody likes me, why did daddy leave me, baaaawwwhhh..."

Personally I dont think Nimander and L'oric are inclined to fight each other if the oppertunity arrises. They are both pretty level headed... and emotional.

[Bapop]

I must disagree here with Aptorian, *hides in shame* because I saw Loric as one of the really great guys of HoC even if he did turn a bit inconsiderate in BH. However this might be due to the fact that I'm both a Nimander fan-boy and have a thing going for the Tiste Liosan but Nimander and L'oric are actually two of my favourite characters so far, although the mage from RG (Beak?) tops my list. And Nimander should be a accendant considering that he had eleint blood, didn't he (will find quote if neccesary) plus he's the son of Anomandaris and that's gotta count for something

Yet I must agree with Aptorian that they aren't likely to fight each other, unless L'oric starts to get cocky Liosan style.

This post has been edited by Bapop: 16 April 2009 - 09:32 PM

[Fox]

I doubt that this fight would ever happen, but If it did I think Nimander would win.

Its been hinted that Nimander is Draconean, whereas L'oric is not.

Or did I get that wrong. I thought that it was implied that Nimander was draconean soletaken, but suppressed it because of Adarist's influence.

[Aptorian]

I also can't remember if it's actually stated that L'oric isn't draconean (he should be, just through bloodline) or if he like Nimander just choses not to use his aspect.

Hmm. My money would be on Nimander in... say, a sword fight. L'oric is obviously not much of a fighter, at least from what we know... he seemed willing enough to draw steel in BH, but HOC implied he was a bit of pussy.

But L'oric wouldn't fight a real opponent with a blade, much more logical to blast them to ash at a hundred paces.

[Shadowperch]

I suppose the larger question here is what would we like to see happen to the remaining Tiste? One big cataclysmic battle between andii, edur and liosan or an alliance against the CG or something other- One theme that seems to reoccur is mortals/humans dealing with their own messes and in a way outgrowing the need for Gods/Ascendents/immortals (not sure but isn't there a plan by shadowthrone to sit on every throne and then do nothing so everyone can just live their lives without interference?) If so what role will these ancient races have?

[Chris]

Shadowperch, on Apr 17 2009, 06:57 AM, said:

I suppose the larger question here is what would we like to see happen to the remaining Tiste? One big cataclysmic battle between andii, edur and liosan or an alliance against the CG or something other- One theme that seems to reoccur is mortals/humans dealing with their own messes and in a way outgrowing the need for Gods/Ascendents/immortals (not sure but isn't there a plan by shadowthrone to sit on every throne and then do nothing so everyone can just live their lives without interference?) If so what role will these ancient races have?

I'm not sure what to expect from the Tiste Andii in the future. They have been characterized as brooding, indifferent, and for the most part depressed. There is always something bleak and unchanging about Andii. But how do they change now that Mother Dark has returned?

The Andii we see in Endest Silann's flashbacks to Kharkanas seem to be a vastly different people than those we are used to--they are in the midst of what seems to be at least a three way battle or civil war of some sort. Does the return of Mother Dark change the Andii because they now have a unifying force other than Rake? I think the Andii do change significantly because Mother Dark seems willing to accept the worship that Rake always scorned.

I would think that the return of Mother Dark would have a dramatic impact on the Andii and their dispositions, but how quickly can the dispositions of members of an immortal race actually change? I'm unsure what role the Andii will play. The "old" Andii would have been content to sit in Black Coral and be left alone, I think. Especially without Rake's leading them in pursuit of some new mortal cause or war. But, I'm not sure where the "new" Andii with the return of Mother Dark and following Nimander will go. Nimander shares many of Rake's leadership qualities, but Nimander seems much more driven to do what is "right." I imagine he will pick a side in the conflict and do his best to make sure that side comes out on top.

[Shadowperch]

I think there may become a rift between MD and Nemander. One using Andii for her own ends and the other trying to do what is best for his people. I expect there to be a parralell with L'oric and osserc here with the Liosans. We have seen that Osserc really has little time for his followers but that doesn't mean if needs be he wouldn't use them. As to L'orics power I think anyone who can get a demon to play god to keep his people happy has to have more up his sleave than what we've seen so far. I take the point that both characters are too Emo and why would they fight each other. Obviously neither possess the arrogance of other characters but I just have a feeling that if they met they just wouldn't become best buds.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

I can definitely see that happening. L'oric won't be able to help but notice the death of Rake, and his replacement.

I alos don't like him much. He's bloody arrogant, and such a wuss. Get this-in BH, he was whinging because of his inability to garner followers. Why the hell do you think that is, moron?