[cerveza_fiesta]

So, as part of my new year resolution, I'm getting fit...like 10000000000 other people.

I don't need to do much because I'm generally active at work, cycle and climb a lot, so the muscle tone and base-level cardio fitness is already there. I just want to lose 10-15 lbs of extra gut fat.

My main problem is that I overeat chronically. I have a high metabolism naturally (thank freakin god) and stay around 195 lbs with an average-to-ectomorphic build at 6feet tall. More or less average...a bit on the heavier side. My target would be to get back in the 180lbs vicinity without losing muscle mass...or to remain the same weight and convert the fatness into muscliness.

I eat good stuff 90% of the time but am severely lacking in the nutrition planning department...which means if I'm not full I'll immediately pull out the crackers and cheese / granola bar / whatever's in the cupboard to top up. This is usually because there's just a lack of good alternatives in the house due to my poor planning.

My question then, to anybody who is into this stuff:

• Do you follow any specific plan with your grocery shopping and meal planning?
  
• If so where did you learn to do it?
  
• Was it easy to switch?
  
• Can you recommend any good natural (no creatine or weight loss drugs, etc...) products/suppliments that you find work for you?

Anything to get me started really. The whole thing is just daunting to me.

[Slow Ben]

Hello CF, i'm a personal trainer so i'll just tell you the basic things i tell my clients when they are starting out.


The first thing is that you have to break out of the traditional 3 meals a day thing. Big meals cause insulin spikes in your body which tell it to store fat because your getting more than you need. Start trying to eat 5-6 smaller meals a day. My normal day is oatmeal or whole grain cereal with some fruit or a good granola bar around 7, an apple or some other fruit with a stick of cheese around 10, a sandwich around 2, something small for dinner around 5-6, then a reasonable snack around 8. For one thing all this eating speeds up your metabolism more. Plus it helps you keep from eating huge meals because you dont let yourself get really hungry before a meal. If its been a few hours and your hungry, have one of your snacks. One thing, if your doing this and you still feel hungry all the time, try having a big breakfast. If you fill your stomach up early in the day your not as starving at night because you have something to burn.

Try shopping for food once or twice a week instead of big trips. Get only the food you'll eat for a few days so you can buy fresh NOT processed food. Processed food is full of crap you dont want. Make sure you get plenty of whole grains, lean meat (i.e. grilled chicken, fish, beef is ok in moderation), Vegetables (try the steamfresh in the frozen foods, their excellent). Also, if you cant have sweets in the house without eating them, dont buy them. My desert at night is usually a fiber one chocolate chip granola bar. Their not great for you but not bad either and their better than ice cream or cookies.

As far as supplements go the most natural is probably green tea, you can get them in capsules but i wouldnt suggest it since their usually spiked with caffeine, but their not THAT bad for you if you wanted to try them

The only one i would suggest for sure is L glutamine. Basically what it does is when your on a calorie restricted diet or trying to lose weight, it helps protect your muscles from losing mass so you only lose fat.

Thats just a general overview, if you need anything just ask.

[Slum]

Stop getting stoned at night and pigging out on cereal....

Oh, wait....that's my problem.


Seriously, though, SB offers good advice.

[Mezla PigDog]

Slow Ben, on Feb 19 2009, 12:30 PM, said:

Hello CF, i'm a personal trainer so i'll just tell you the basic things i tell my clients when they are starting out.

I hate you. But in a friendly way

[Slow Ben]

Fair enough, i get that sometimes.

[frookenhauer]

I hate you too, but in an unfriendly way

I'm so goddamn fat I have to put my belt on with a boomerang and its not fair!

[Satan]

Slow Ben, on Feb 19 2009, 06:30 PM, said:

Hello CF, i'm a personal trainer so i'll just tell you the basic things i tell my clients when they are starting out.

I was really expecting a "I eat 100 tread mills per day" post after this line.

For just loosing weight, I'd recommend water. Most people drink far to little of it (doctors say 3 litres per day - minimum), and it momentarily kills that empty hole in your belly when you're hungry. Also, if you're going on that green tea diet, I'd reccommend the toasted kind. It doesn't have that bitter after taste that el naturale got.

[Slow Ben]

yeah thats a big one too, plenty of water, especially first thing in the morning.

And i didnt want to brag, but i could, in fact, eat a hundred treadmills

[frookenhauer]

I bet I could eat a hundred treadmill eating slow bens!

[amphibian]

You need to figure out how much food to eat for keeping your body the way it is now. If you want to gain weight, you'd eat more than that amount. Since you want to lose weight, you should eat slightly less than that amount.

For instance, I used this link (http://www.freedomfl...nutrition14.htm) just now to calculate a rough estimate of my basal metabolic rate and my "total daily energy expenditure" (add in your activity level).

I ended up with a BMR of 1857.23 and a TDEE of 3203.72 (might be a bit low). Now, I realize that most people aren't as active as I am, but let's proceed with this. If I wanted to lose weight, I would eat slightly less than 3203.72 calories (maybe 300 or 400 less) and eat that amount as clean as possible (as you've been trying to do).

I'll be upfront: I don't keep track of calories. I mostly go by how I feel during and after jiu-jitsu/muay thai, hop on a scale a couple times a week and how I'm looking in the mirror. I believe that I'm eating pretty good because I'm paying attention to my body's feedback cycle and I'm dropping the chub while getting much stronger and better at what I do.

I don't think timing of the meals is that big a deal. I could probably eat that 3000 calories in one sitting and be alright. The "insulin spikes" aren't a huge deal to anyone but diabetics or professional athletes. As it is right now, I eat about four times a day with lunch and dinner being the biggest. Just listen to your body over the course of a couple weeks and go with what it says.

[cerveza_fiesta]

holy shit...100 treadmills!

That's a lot of food. Much more than in my standard gigantic supper.

Ok Slow, makes sense. I've heard the multi-meal instead of 3-meal thing before and have a couple of questions on the planning side of such an eating pattern.

• Are there any good books you'd recommend on the subject? I learn really well from books, but there's about 20 gazillion of them on the subject, of which 19.9999 gazillion of them are probably useless shite. Finding a book is about as daunting as the task of switching my diet at the moment.
  
• I have a very poor concept of serving size and calorie content. Is there a quick n dirty method for evaluating my daily caloric intake or is it something you literally have to read ever single food-info and learn over time? I'm an engineer and tend to think in numbers so something like that could be helpful.
  
• Are there any guidelines for how large each meal on the multi-meal plan should be? More or less evenly divided amongst my planned caloric intake for the day or bigger some meals and smaller on others?
  
• If I do indeed need to think about this in numbers, what would be the best way to find a target calorie number. Should I figure out roughly what I eat on a normal basis and then try to reduce that number or is there a standard average starting point for a person my size?

Other questions

• What is the technical effect of Green tea? I know its good for ya cause that's what TV everybody says, but what's the real physiological effect?
  
• L-Glutamine. What's your experience with it? Works well or anything I should watch out for? Readily available?

Thanks for the answers. I'll research this stuff myself of course, but nice to get opinions from lots of different people.

EDIT

Amphibian: you posted while I was composing. Thanks too...I'll check out that link. Just what I was looking for as a basic guideline to what my caloric intake should be.

This post has been edited by cerveza_fiesta: 19 February 2009 - 07:37 PM

[bubba]

Frookenhauer, on Feb 19 2009, 12:54 PM, said:

I hate you too, but in an unfriendly way

I'm so goddamn fat I have to put my belt on with a boomerang and its not fair!

[attachment=2451:brilliant.jpg]

Brilliant! I always just tie one end to a door nob and spin in to it.

[Slow Ben]

First off, i was going to start by arguing with amp about what he said, but it led me to this point instead. Theres no one way thats right and everything else is wrong, its about finding out what works for you and being able to stick with it.

Sorry, i dont have any books on the subject, the ones i use are leftovers from college so i havent had to get any myself. But if your looking try to find one thats certified by a premier association, like ACE, American Council on Exercise.

The counter Amp said will work fine. As far as size of meals go you have to find what works for you and how your body responds. I've found that if my largest meal is breakfast then i'm not as hungry throughout the day and I can just eat real small meals and get by. But i have some clients who if they eat a big breakfest it makes them hungrier by the afternoon. I'd start by eating meals about the same size and seeing when your the hungriest and going from there.

Basically green tea is an appetite supressant and thats basically just from the caffeine. its safer just to drink lots and lots of water. Most of the time people mistake being thirsty for hunger and eat when they should drink.

L Glutamine in my experience is great, no side affects that i know of. its a natural amino acid in the body an works really well. plus you can get it at about any nutrition place.

[Macros]

I'm guessing pork pies in my lunch box a re no
(I checked their little label, 30% of my rda on sat fat and salt in one little pie, plus lots of other nastyness.)

I figured my diet is affecting my inability to lose weight, and was going to consult my Pt friend, but this thread is mucho helpful, plus rep to ben

[frookenhauer]

Ben is indeed proving to be a most useful person...if we can just get him to stop eating treadmills....

I'm so fat that when I cross the channel by ferry they ask me to remain seated in the middle of the boat

[Macros]

man I'm so fat ....wait a minute!

[Slow Ben]

Or if you wanted to lose weight real fast you could just start using crack, but i dont recommend it.

[Mezla PigDog]

I do not believe it is necessary to use dietary supplements unless you have a legitimate physical deficiency. Why is L-glutamine supposed to be better than the other 19 amino acids required for building protein? It is even made by the body! The whole dietary supplement industry is as facile as the cosmetic industry if you ask me!

/biochemistry mode

[frookenhauer]

DONT MESS WITH BIOCHE-MEZ

You go girl!

[amphibian]

Mezla PigDog, on Feb 19 2009, 03:15 PM, said:

I do not believe it is necessary to use dietary supplements unless you have a legitimate physical deficiency. Why is L-glutamine supposed to be better than the other 19 amino acids required for building protein? It is even made by the body! The whole dietary supplement industry is as facile as the cosmetic industry if you ask me!

/biochemistry mode

Those who it's truly useful for: elite athletes and those who don't produce as much of whatever Substance X is they're taking.

That being said, whey's a cheap way to bulk up some. I can't stand the taste though, so I eat a bunch of eggs, nuts, milk and meats.

Slow Ben, thanks for taking the high road. I wasn't hating on you. Learning how to listen to your body is a key skill in getting fit. Now if only I could stop my big toe from cussing so much (keep jamming it in jiu-jitsu).