[beru]

i have seen LOTS of pages where deathstealer is CG but in TBH when the card is first seen one of the participants in the "game" says that the one with that card have anoter... its clear that CG does NOT fit into the role of King In Chains... who is then, or glitch or some thing like that?

[MTS]

Well Rhulad was originally the King in Chains, and now Skinner is as of RotCG. It has been a position up for grabs for a while, as Kallor also stakes a claim to it, yet gets stuck with Reaver. As for CG being something other than Deathstealer...I don't know. In the BH glossary, there is an Unaligned card named "Chain". Perhaps that is the other card?

[Benji]

I think what they were saying is that they THOUGHT The King in Chains would be The Crippled God. They were wrong of course, but it seems to be a perfectly reasonable assumption.

[Seguleh 1st]

By the way its Lifeslayer and Deathslayer. Those are the names of the cards. You people confuse it with Icariums Nickname Lifestealer because he is of course Lifeslayer too. But Deathstealer does not exist.

[HoosierDaddy]

The Crippled God is both Deathstealer and possibly Chain.

[Seguleh 1st]

DEATHSLAYER!!! Look my post above

[HoosierDaddy]

Quit being pedantic.

"The Crippled God is both Deathslayer and possibly Chain."

Feel better?

[Seguleh 1st]

i'm delighted. no really i didnt want to unnerv you.

[D'rek]

However, based on the way "Chain" is the single-word-inanimate-object kind of card, and an unaligned, it's quite probable it's like Sceptre, Throne, Orb, etc, a pseudo-natural-force that isn't quite so personifical, though that don't mean it can't represent people in readings and games and stuff.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

If the CG is outside the House of Chains, does his mean Paran shouldn't have blessed it?

[MTS]

Paran's rationale for blessing the House of Chains was to place the CG inside the game, and subject him to the "rules" that everyone else seems to have to follow. Not being in the House itself wouldn't matter. The CG works through his pawns, and if they are inside the House, then he must make sure they (and by extension he) follow the "rules". Although what these rules are I have no idea...

[Cougar]

I'm unsure from the original post what you are asking in the first part, nor can I look up the quote right now but, I'd point out one of our favorite mantras: a position in a reading of the deck is not the same as a position in a house. Lots of different things can happen in readings with individuals being represented by cards because of choices, actions etc which conform to the character of the card. For instance we have seen Anomander represented by Knight of Darkness, a position he also holds, but Fiddler represented as soldier of life, which we are not sure if he holds or not, although there is no evidence he does.

Hossier; unless there is some evidence you can bring to the table that suggests that the CG is chain then I'd be inclined to disagree with you; the position in the deck existed as an unaligned before the CG & House of Chains were accepted into the deck. If you are going off his nickname 'the chained one' alone then this is likely to be a red herring as the chain theme is used a lot by Erikson without reference to the CG.

This post has been edited by Cougar: 14 January 2009 - 08:55 AM

[Ain't_It_Just_]

The Chain...it's a pity we don't know the identities of more Unaligned apart from Obelisk/Burn because then we might be able to discern more information.

[Cougar]

I don't think that each card necessarily has a personification, some maybe dormant, only at play on certain occasions or even just forces.

[D'rek]

The way Fiddler closes one of his games (GotM I think) with an unaligned and declares that "True sight and judgement closes this game" makes me think most of the Unaligned, like Sceptre, Orb, Throne, Crown, Chain and even Obelisk to to some extent are more inanimate and don't often represent people, being more like a set of actions or personality. Though 3 of them did represent Withal's Nachts in tBH...

[Ain't_It_Just_]

GODDAMNIT Grub's friends why didn't I think of that...I'm so ignorant.

[Tattersail_]

D, on 14 January 2009 - 03:25 PM, said:

The way Fiddler closes one of his games (GotM I think) with an unaligned and declares that "True sight and judgement closes this game" makes me think most of the Unaligned, like Sceptre, Orb, Throne, Crown, Chain and even Obelisk to to some extent are more inanimate and don't often represent people, being more like a set of actions or personality. Though 3 of them did represent Withal's Nachts in tBH...

what three where those ones? Just remind me please, or quote it if you can

[MTS]

They were Crown, Sceptre and Orb.

Quote

Fist, where’s Grub hiding these days?’
‘On Nok’s ship,’ Keneb replied, bewildered and strangely frightened.
‘Well, that knocks you outa the game, though you still get four more cards, since we’ve made a course
correction and the northeast headland’s rising up two pegs to starboard. In seventy heartbeats we’ll be
sliding closest to that rocky coast, and Nok’s ship will be even closer, and Grub will dive overboard.
He’s got three friends living in the caves in the cliff and here are their cards—’ Three more skidded out to
just beyond the centre of the table. ‘Crown, Sceptre, Orb. Hmm, let’s ignore those for now.’

[Tattersail_]

what did they mean? Crown Scpetre and Orb relating to the nachts?

[lifeslayer]

Ain, on 14 January 2009 - 10:10 AM, said:

The Chain...it's a pity we don't know the identities of more Unaligned apart from Obelisk/Burn because then we might be able to discern more information.

I don't know why I assumed this, but I keep thinking that the Unaligned Chain is Karsa. Also, there's allusions to the chains of souls he drags around with him - I remember Samar Dev saying it at least once in TBH and perhaps again in RG.

He was at one point the Knight of Chains, right? I don't know if that's true any longer.