[paladin]

oh, you were talking about mccain. noones calling mccain a flipflopper because everyone knows hes just pandering for the vote.

[HoosierDaddy]

paladin;348121 said:

oh, you were talking about mccain. noones calling mccain a flipflopper because everyone knows hes just pandering for the vote.

Isn't that the jist of a flip-flopper? Kerry got hammered by the right in '04 for being a flip flopper!!!!!. But it seems McCain is mostly getting a freebie on it so far outside of those like myself on the radical left.

[paladin]

but kerry was serious about it. mccain is comical and noone is fooled

[HoosierDaddy]

paladin;348134 said:

mccain is comical and noone is fooled

How I wish this was true. Many an ignorant American will be fooled because Fox News doesn't lie, and Obama is a Islamic-Terrorist while John McCain is somehow both Bushian and enough of a maverick to be the change we need.

[Obdigore]

Also, McCain's military experience means he has the skills needed to be in charge of the country.

[HoosierDaddy]

Obdigore;348144 said:

Also, McCain's military experience means he has the skills needed to be in charge of the country.

Well, they'll stick their hat on his "american hero-foreign policy knowledge". Like not knowing the difference between a Shiite and Sunni (although I'm sure he knows now. Whether he has a senior moment and forgets again...). That sort of stuff.

[paladin]

honestly i think the election wont be about that.

obama seems like your typical al gore/howard dean smug posturing democrat, and the voters didnt agree with that the last few times out.

mccain is in the same group as dole, and i think he learned from doles campaign that you have to let your personality come out. dole would have stood a much better chance if he didnt hide his personality from the voters during the campaign.

i think the election will be more about personality and experience than anything else. clinton won on personality. reagan won on personality. this is the type of election that will be decided on those types of things. bush is out and he has no personality; he is not a charismatic leader. mccain has shown, despite his age, that hes a bit more "hip" and able to communicate smoothly. obama on the other hand seems typical east coast smug, a little too self important. obama hasn't earned his way into being smug yet, and that smug is what ruined gore in 00.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

HoosierDaddy;348136 said:

How I wish this was true. Many an ignorant American will be fooled because Fox News doesn't lie, and Obama is a Islamic-Terrorist while John McCain is somehow both Bushian and enough of a maverick to be the change we need.

A lot of people are fooled, sadly. Members of my own family send me republican propaganda daily. Sickening.

[HoosierDaddy]

paladin;348155 said:

honestly i think the election wont be about that.

obama seems like your typical al gore/howard dean smug posturing democrat, and the voters didnt agree with that the last few times out.

obama on the other hand seems typical east coast smug, a little too self important. obama hasn't earned his way into being smug yet, and that smug is what ruined gore in 00.

Why do you think Obama is smug? Is it because he's smart and shows it? Or because he's charismatic and good-natured? He hasn't made any smug comments about McCain. He's disagreed with him, but he hasn't acted like he's better than him in any sort of way. So, again, why do you think he is smug?

[Terez]

If it's about personality, then Obama wins hands down.

[HoosierDaddy]

Raymond Luxury Yacht;348158 said:

A lot of people are fooled, sadly. Members of my own family send me republican propaganda daily. Sickening.

Do you send them back links that show that propaganda isn't true? Or are they the sort who want to believe it because it makes it easier? I know quite a few people like that, willing to believe whatever it takes to vote the way they want to.

[paladin]

the way he carries himself, the way he poses for pictures, the way he makes statements, etc. he has no self-depreciation. he comes off as one that believes he has all the right answers eventhough he rarely provides detail when asked about them. watching the debates he came off very similar to al gore to me, that he doesnt really need to answer the question, he just has to talk to people can hear him speak because people should vote for him because hes the best.

[HoosierDaddy]

paladin;348174 said:

the way he carries himself, the way he poses for pictures, the way he makes statements, etc. he has no self-depreciation. he comes off as one that believes he has all the right answers eventhough he rarely provides detail when asked about them. watching the debates he came off very similar to al gore to me, that he doesnt really need to answer the question, he just has to talk to people can hear him speak because people should vote for him because hes the best.

So you think he's arrogant. I guess I must have my blue blinders on.

Anyways, Bush has that damn constant smirk on his face no matter what he's saying. He's obviously arrogant and doesn't give a damn about anything. Have you ever watched a John McCain speech? He looks like the cat that ate the canary. "My friends, "that is change you can believe in." When he says that he seems very, very arrogant and smug.

[Dolorous Menhir]

Paladin, are you for real? Did you just argue, with a straight face, that McCain has better charisma and a more likeable personality than Obama?

It's like you want us to lose all respect for your opinion.

And then you follow it up with the post above this one, which doesn't even make sense. What is that last sentence trying to say? Is that your next ludicrous comparison - that McCain is heavier on policy detail than Obama? Are you insane?

Look, I understand that you prefer McCain to Obama. That's clear, and it's fair enough. But these justifications you're making for it are laughable.

[paladin]

i wasnt making any comparison to mccain in my last post. i believe mccains voting history should speak for itself in that regard; it gives you a guideline. obama doesnt have much of a voting history, which is part of my problem with him(and goes hand in hand with my dislike for him not elaborating much on how he will change things besides some rudimentary explaination).

i would have preferred clinton to have a 3rd term rather than bush in 00. i would also have preferred dole over clinton in 96. this year i would rather have had ron paul(the nation needs a bit of a fiscal conservative and it doesnt get much more fiscally conservative than a libertarian).

the main reason i like mccain comes directly from him being from the southwest. he knows my issues better than obama and i agree with him on the need for positive immigration reform and i agree with the method he has proposed previously. his other politics are whatever, but his voting history doesnt scare me into not voting for him.

likeability wise, sure. he comes off a lot more real and a lot more grounded in reality than obama; he makes effort to make change in things that really matter(such as his immigration bill) rather than talking about the same idealistic change every other candidate in recent history has talked about and never pushed, and this makes him more likeable to me because i believe he will try to attempt the things he promises. hes also similar to dole, who was very likeable when he let his personality out.

[Obdigore]

Really? Going to war with Iran and 'staying the course' in Iraq are 'whatever' for you?

[paladin]

i think iraq is something we cant do anything more about. if we pull out, it collapses. theres not much we can do at this point unless we go totally isolationist to justify the anarchy that would happen. what do you suggest other than letting it run its course naturally?

as far as iran, i dont believe we'll do anything until anything is done to us. we dont have the resources. we'll let israel handle it if we need to and provide them with tomahawks, f16s, and ammo

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Right, we'd never attack another country without being attacked first. You do realize that Mccain is from the party that invented the term preemptive strike, right?

[paladin]

yes, i do, but again, i dont think we have the resources to do it. and remember slick willy did it as well with guided missile strikes. unprovoked

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

We didn't have the resources to do it in Iraq, but that didn't stop us. Guided missile strikes are very different from a full invasion and regime change, which is what I think McCain is up to.