[iso9001]

Hi all,

This book is just great. I am now on chapter 5 and am always curious whenever I am away from the book. Is this normal

Quick questions:

1) IIRC, Tays insisted that Ben would be a high mage but when they meet with Dujek and Kalam around, they verbally spar about being a high mage (Ben calls colleague).I am curious what changed between them. Why Tays is uncomfortable with Ben's bening high mage?
2) I love how the rulers are often ignored, especially Cot What about you?

Regards

[Esa1996]

Can't remember any real answers for the first one. Perhaps he just feels that Quick is getting arrogant?


I really like everything with Cotillion and / or Shadowthrone. Can't remember anyone disobeying / ignoring them though

[Abyss]

1. Tays realized, or stopped pretending he didn't know, just how powerful and intelligent QB was. But by doing so he was also saying 'I'm onto your game smart guy'. It didn't make them friends, even if they were allies.
2. Huh?

[Kanese S's]

iso9001, on 09 March 2016 - 03:51 PM, said:

Hi all,

This book is just great. I am now on chapter 5 and am always curious whenever I am away from the book. Is this normal

Quick questions:

1) IIRC, Tays insisted that Ben would be a high mage but when they meet with Dujek and Kalam around, they verbally spar about being a high mage (Ben calls colleague).I am curious what changed between them. Why Tays is uncomfortable with Ben's bening high mage?
2) I love how the rulers are often ignored, especially Cot What about you?

Regards

1. Tays probably felt QB was getting a bit too cocky. Which is entirely fair.
2. Yes.

[iso9001]

Thank you all.

There is one thing I am having difficulty understanding. I get that Tavore doesn't trust Ben, Kalam, and Pearl. But is this mistrust more important than the lives of her army? What could they possibly do to deserve to be sent or kept away? And besides, iirc, Tavore asked Kalam of recruiting and training new assassins. If she doesn't trust him, why does she assign this task to Kalam?

Regards

[Gorefest]

Who says she doesn't trust them? Tavore just isn't the 'sharing info' type.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 15 March 2016 - 05:02 PM

[Nevyn]

iso9001, on 09 March 2016 - 03:51 PM, said:

Hi all,

This book is just great. I am now on chapter 5 and am always curious whenever I am away from the book. Is this normal

Quick questions:

1) IIRC, Tays insisted that Ben would be a high mage but when they meet with Dujek and Kalam around, they verbally spar about being a high mage (Ben calls colleague).I am curious what changed between them. Why Tays is uncomfortable with Ben's bening high mage?
2) I love how the rulers are often ignored, especially Cot What about you?

Regards

1) Ben had been hiding for years as a squad mage despite being one of the most powerful mages around. When Tay discovered this, he basically made QB a high mage instead of letting him continue to hide/pretend.

High mage talk can be a tad confusing too, because in some places it is used as a Malazan rank, and others it is an informal grading of power. Anyway, QB was field promoted to high mage, and in the section you are talking about he is needling Tay and being a bit presumptive, suggesting that they are on the same footing, rank wise. And so Tay pokes back, suggesting that Ben just has a non-confirmed rank, from with they get into some back and forth about their history, some of which Tay did not even know was Ben.

So nothing really changed. Just verbal sparring. Imagine you were a 3 star general and you field promoted someone within your command to general, and then in a meeting they called you colleague instead of sir, implying you were on the same footing rank wise.

Also, in this case, the field promotion was about his sorcerous power. You want a sorcerer that strong to be a key voice in plans being made and actions taken. But that means the rank is more a byproduct than reflecting the idea that you actually want that person commanding people and influencing decisions.

y he now has an influential rank, but not because the empress or anyone else of particular power2) Cot is a ruler?

[iso9001]

Nevyn, on 15 March 2016 - 07:04 PM, said:

1) Ben had been hiding for years as a squad mage despite being one of the most powerful mages around. When Tay discovered this, he basically made QB a high mage instead of letting him continue to hide/pretend.

High mage talk can be a tad confusing too, because in some places it is used as a Malazan rank, and others it is an informal grading of power. Anyway, QB was field promoted to high mage, and in the section you are talking about he is needling Tay and being a bit presumptive, suggesting that they are on the same footing, rank wise. And so Tay pokes back, suggesting that Ben just has a non-confirmed rank, from with they get into some back and forth about their history, some of which Tay did not even know was Ben.

So nothing really changed. Just verbal sparring. Imagine you were a 3 star general and you field promoted someone within your command to general, and then in a meeting they called you colleague instead of sir, implying you were on the same footing rank wise.

Also, in this case, the field promotion was about his sorcerous power. You want a sorcerer that strong to be a key voice in plans being made and actions taken. But that means the rank is more a byproduct than reflecting the idea that you actually want that person commanding people and influencing decisions.

y he now has an influential rank, but not because the empress or anyone else of particular power2) Cot is a ruler?

Thank you Nevyn,

The phrase "ruler" was copied from TOR re-reads I also agree with the term as he is considered a God.

Regards

[iso9001]

Gorefest, on 15 March 2016 - 05:02 PM, said:

Who says she doesn't trust them? Tavore just isn't the 'sharing info' type.

I read it both in the book and in the TOR re-reads. Here is a phrase from chapter 7 from TOR: Pearl tells Lostara he could slip in and kill Leoman but Tavore won’t let him, and Lostara says Tavore doesn’t trust him and doesn’t blame her.

There were several other similar phrases like this one. I can see that Quick and Kalam investigating the K'Chain but Pearl's sitting idle and complaining has no meaning.

Regards

[Gorefest]

Well, Pearl is untrustworthy because he works for the Empress, being an active claw and all that. I just don't buy that she is sending people away out of mistrust. There is a good reason why she is giving people quests.

[iso9001]

Gorefest, on 21 March 2016 - 12:45 PM, said:

Well, Pearl is untrustworthy because he works for the Empress, being an active claw and all that. I just don't buy that she is sending people away out of mistrust. There is a good reason why she is giving people quests.

I agree with her sending people away not out of mistrust but Tavore is an Adjunct who also works for the Empress. One's working for Empress doesn't necessarily make him/her untrustworthy. Besides, what would have he done given the chance?

Regards

[Gorefest]

Well, hrm. RAFO.

[iso9001]

Gorefest, on 21 March 2016 - 12:55 PM, said:

Well, hrm. RAFO.

Thanks

[Nevyn]

On the subject of Tavore, I won't get into any detail, other than to say that we never actually get her POV. We see her through the perceptions of others, and given her stoic, secretive nature, those perceptions can be all over the place and may or may not be accurate.

[iso9001]

Thank you Nevyn,

I have some other questions


1) What is Balm's confusion? Is it something that happens to soldiers about to war?
2) Nether tells just after the fires in Y'ghatan that a fire elemental is about to be born. What exactly is a fire elemental? RAFO?
3) I couldn't understand the deal among Queen of Dreams, Leoman, and L'oric? I think this is also RAFO but what I am curios is the deal between L'oric and Queen of Dreams.
4) What was the honey (God Bringer iirc) they eat and used for their burns?
5) "Seven hundred and ninety-one. Out of three thousand." Is this remaining soldiers or the dead?
6) Grub tells Keneb that something's buried. Is it the buried soldiers or something else?
7) Who did Pearl lose? I think it's not Lostara since she was pulled away and if the one pulled her was Pearl, he would know that she was alive (is she?). So it is either Pearl thinks Lostara is dead or Lostara is saved by someone else. And if she was, who might that be? Maybe Cotillion?
8) What is Grub's special force? How come he knows a lot when others fail?
9) Treach was slain by two K'Chain. I believe he was not a god nor an ascendant by the time but a soletaken so he was not so much powerful while fighting the two K'Chain, is this right?

Regards

This post has been edited by iso9001: 22 March 2016 - 03:37 PM

[iso9001]

Hi all,

One more to add the list

10) Has Paran really ascended? How and when?

Regards

[Abyss]

iso9001, on 21 March 2016 - 02:44 PM, said:

1) What is Balm's confusion? Is it something that happens to soldiers about to war?

They say so in the book.

Quote

2) Nether tells just after the fires in Y'ghatan that a fire elemental is about to be born. What exactly is a fire elemental? RAFO?

What you saw is what you got.

Quote

3) I couldn't understand the deal among Queen of Dreams, Leoman, and L'oric? I think this is also RAFO but what I am curios is the deal between L'oric and Queen of Dreams.

Loric summoned the QoD. The QoD cut a deal with Leoman to extract him and a few others, which turned out to be just Dunsparrow, from the city.

We don't know as of TB what Leoman's part of the deal is.

Quote

4) What was the honey (God Bringer iirc) they eat and used for their burns?

It was magic Jaghut honey, good for eating and for burns.

Quote

5) "Seven hundred and ninety-one. Out of three thousand." Is this remaining soldiers or the dead?

Read the paragraph.

Quote

6) Grub tells Keneb that something's buried. Is it the buried soldiers or something else?

The soldiers.

Quote

7) Who did Pearl lose?...

Lostara.




Ok seriously ISO maybe you better read the book again...

Quote

8) What is Grub's special force? How come he knows a lot when others fail?

RAFO, but recall back in HoC he was identified in a chapter opener as the future First Sword of the Late Empire.

Also he survived the Chain of Dogs.

Quote

9) Treach was slain by two K'Chain. I believe he was not a god nor an ascendant by the time but a soletaken so he was not so much powerful while fighting the two K'Chain, is this right?

He was a soletaken ascendant, worshipped as a god of war.

Just not a very powerful one.

iso9001, on 22 March 2016 - 03:38 PM, said:

10) Has Paran really ascended? How and when?

Think about it... he kicked open the gates of a city and faced down the goddess of sickness. He is clearly not a mere human any longer. This has been going on since he died back in GotM, got better, touched Hound blood, strolled through Dragnipur, was made Master of the Deck, bonded with a resurrected Imass Bonecaster/Elder Goddess, strolled thru Dragnipur again, took up residence in an Azath House...

[Nevyn]

Wow, some of these questions are coming down to very fine points ,specific lines of dialogue in a giant novel. And some of those will be clearer as you read. Some may be trivial and some important, so a lot of RAFO
1) Just a unique trait for him, I think
2) Use your imagination. Sort of like a firestorm taking on a life of its own.
3) RAFO
4) You know as much as us. Something in the way the honey is preserved gives it an opiate-like effect.
5) remaining
6) RAFO
7) RAFO
8) RAFO
9) That is more of less correct.
10) Paran is Master of the Deck. What does that mean? RAFO.

[iso9001]

Thank you Abyss and Nevyn,

I am reading the book AND TOR re-reads concurrently. When I finish a chapter, I read TOR in order to clarify the chapter. These questions are mostly from the re-reads and thus I do not have the whole paragprahs as I take my notes. Besides, I know the answers to some questions but I want to be sure so I ask them anyway.

As four your answers;

3) L'oric summoned QoD but what does he get from this deal?
7) You cut my sentence short But as I said before, I am double reading the book. I will also read the book a third time when it is published in my country.
8) Yes I remember him being the future First Sword and I hated the spoiler but idk why

Regards

[Gorefest]

It's not a spoiler when the author deliberately states it, it is a foretelling. It's a perfectly fine tool to add gravitas to a newly introduced character and it also gives the whole tale a sense of longevity and epic scale. Suddenly you go from the moment to a generation.