[QuickTidal]

MODGOD NOTICE OF THREAD SPLIT
THIS THREAD SPUN OFF FROM GENERAL TV THREAD.

amphibian, on 28 November 2011 - 02:41 AM, said:

Tonight's episode of Once Upon a Time was awful. D-level bad.

The showrunners still haven't worked out how to get the kid's impulse to get everyone to remember their fairy tale origins into the show in an organic way. It's turned just about every character outside of Rumplestiltskin into a one-note bore. Hopefully, the show improves from this low point during next week's Prince Charming episode.

I actually liked the aspect of it about Jimminy Cricket's backstory with his cruel parents and the ending as well for him in fairyland, but the earthbound story with the mine and crap was pretty lame, I agree. Yeah, I think that's one aspect of the show that needs work, is the organics of uniting the kids beliefs with the modern day world.

I will say that I really liked the brief moments of Mary Margaret and James (though it may be because I have a crush on Ginnifer Goodwin) the best though, which I shouldn't because they weren't the main bit, but I enjoyed how their interaction is already strong.

That said, overall the whole episode was probably one of the worst this season so far...but I agree next week's ep looks better...most especially because of CG dragon battling.

Still, what are we...5 episodes in and only one bad one. Not too shabby for a record considering some of the crap out there.

Disney nod: The dalmatian is named Pongo...nice touch that.

Another LOST nod this week: Henry was carrying Apollo chocolate bars (a fictional bar from the Dharma Initiative supplies)

That's part of the show I am always on the lookout for, as there have been A LOT of them so far and the production team says that those easter eggs will continue.

The list so far (other than above mentioned ones):

In the Pilot episode, the clock tower is stuck at the time 8:15, an allusion to Oceanic flight 815.
It is also revealed in the pilot that Regina and Henry's house address is 108, an allusion to the button needing to pushed every 108 minutes.
In the pilot episode, a scene starts with a closeup of Emma's eye, which was a common scene starter in LOST.
Emma has a Geronimo Jackson bumpersticker, which was a fictional band sometimes mentioned in LOST.
In the episode Snow Falls, there are a bunch of crickets chirping followed by the signature sound of the smoke monster.
In the episode Snow Falls, Henry yells out, "We have to go back," alluding to the line uttered by Jack in the Season 3 finale.

[Abyss]

re ONCE UPON A TIME... as a complete aside i like how the 'lurking in the woods' character at the beginning titles keeps changing.

Ageed, weakest ep so far. Decent, but lacking. The Mayor and Emma's by-play is becoming tedious. It needs to severaly escalate or one of them needs to do something unexpected.

Anyone know what that was supposed to be at the bottom of the mine at the end?

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 28 November 2011 - 04:32 PM, said:

re ONCE UPON A TIME... as a complete aside i like how the 'lurking in the woods' character at the beginning titles keeps changing.

Ageed, weakest ep so far. Decent, but lacking. The Mayor and Emma's by-play is becoming tedious. It needs to severaly escalate or one of them needs to do something unexpected.

Anyone know what that was supposed to be at the bottom of the mine at the end?

From what I hear the last few eps before the winter break are going to be really good, including going in some directions people aren't expecting including a major character death. I agree that the MAyor and Emma's relationship is getting a bit of the same ole same ole, so hopefully they'll change up that dynamic soonish.

The thing in the mine at the end of the episode (the little piece she holds and drops and whole broken item on the mine floor) is Snow White's broken glass coffin. I believe the significance being that it is one of the first proper ITEMS (other than people) that made its way into the earthbound world from Fairytale land, and would be a HUGE factor in revealing to Snow who she and everyone else are, and the mayor's discarding of it into the collapsed mineshaft seems to solidify the theory that she (mayor/evil queen) is well aware of where they all came from and who she really is (not suffering from the amnesia that grips everyone else). A cryptic, but altogether welcome nod as having that fairytale item shows up means it either was brought there by someone, or there are places where the fairytale land still bleeds through?

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 28 November 2011 - 05:32 PM

[Abyss]

QuickTidal, on 28 November 2011 - 05:24 PM, said:

...thing in the mine at the end of the episode (the little piece she holds and drops and whole broken item on the mine floor) is Snow White's broken glass coffin. ...

Talk about vague, we haven't seen that since the premiere.

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 28 November 2011 - 05:58 PM, said:

QuickTidal, on 28 November 2011 - 05:24 PM, said:

...thing in the mine at the end of the episode (the little piece she holds and drops and whole broken item on the mine floor) is Snow White's broken glass coffin. ...

Talk about vague, we haven't seen that since the premiere.

LOL, Oh, I know...I had to look it up myself.

However, I was thinking about if they had done a quick flashback ref. or some other kind of reminder instead to make it easier to spot, people would have been annoyed by blatant foreshadowing, so the more I thought about it, the more I liked that I actually had to puzzle about what it was and look it up.

Either way, a very interesting development.

[Abyss]

QuickTidal, on 28 November 2011 - 06:01 PM, said:

Abyss, on 28 November 2011 - 05:58 PM, said:

QuickTidal, on 28 November 2011 - 05:24 PM, said:

...thing in the mine at the end of the episode (the little piece she holds and drops and whole broken item on the mine floor) is Snow White's broken glass coffin. ...

Talk about vague, we haven't seen that since the premiere.

LOL, Oh, I know...I had to look it up myself.

However, I was thinking about if they had done a quick flashback ref. or some other kind of reminder instead to make it easier to spot, people would have been annoyed by blatant foreshadowing, so the more I thought about it, the more I liked that I actually had to puzzle about what it was and look it up.

Either way, a very interesting development.

totally interesting development, but the only way to know wtf was to look online for someone else who figured it out or had an inside scoop. That's tv fail in my book. Not a big deal, but the impact of the big reveal was mostly lost.

[QuickTidal]

Even though you could tell that they spent their entire episode Effect budget on the Dragon (which was pretty damn cool), last night's ONCE UPON A TIME was pretty damned good, both the fairytale (twin princes) storyline (I think the scene between James and his mom was one of the most emotive on the show yet), and the modern world (David & Mary Margaret love story bittersweet) storyline.

Does Alan Dale always have to play an asshole dad? LOL

The more they tell the David and Mary Margaret story the more compelling I find it. Tying the end of James (David)'s story into the beginning of Snow White's was nicely done. I like that they aren't allowing David and Mary Margaret's story to be tied up into a quick little love bow, and it's even better that he TOTALLY led her on and has now pissed her off...and wtf is up with The Doctor (Sark ALIAS guy)....what's his agenda?

Anyways, a much better ep than last week, and next week looks like a doozy.

Once again Robby Carlyle OWNS every scene he is in! He's a scenery chewing machine. Hell, I'd watch the ROBERT CARLYLE GIGGLES MANIACALLY, AND FUCKS YOU UP WITH DARK MAGIC HOUR.

My ONLY real issue was one of logistics. The Prince could NOT have slain the dragon with a GOLD sword. Gold is a soft metal isn't it?

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 05 December 2011 - 01:37 PM

[QuickTidal]

Oh, and Bill Willingham (creator of the amazing comic series FABLES) has posted an interview he did with himself about the similarities between FABLES and ONCE...and is very open about what went down and how to view the similarities.

http://www.comicbook...rticle&id=35737

Basically he's cool with it, and feels that although they are playing in the same sandbox, they are different worlds and stories.

This article reminds me I haven't read the last couple of FABLES trades and I need to rectify that.

Oh, and he tells us that the Sheriff (who's fairlyland identity we don't know yet) is NOT Big Bad Wolf...and that solidifies my theory that I've had since the beginning which is that he is Little Boy Blue. Who knows though.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 05 December 2011 - 02:23 PM

[Abyss]

QuickTidal, on 05 December 2011 - 01:34 PM, said:

... I'd watch the ROBERT CARLYLE GIGGLES MANIACALLY, AND FUCKS YOU UP WITH DARK MAGIC HOUR.

I'd watch it twice.
Three times if John Noble co-starred as a mad fringe scientist challenging Carlyle's dark magic with his mad science...

I think i just wet myself a little.

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The Prince could NOT have slain the dragon with a GOLD sword. Gold is a soft metal isn't it?

Dude ...'magic'....

[Slow Ben]

Yeah, Carlyle is awesome.

The rest...meh. I'm pretty bored with the show at this point, not my style.

But, since the ole lady loves it I get to keep watching!

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 05 December 2011 - 05:37 PM, said:

Dude ...'magic'....

Nods sagely. Understood.

So I'm curious to see a second season get picked up for this, since the first season of any effects heavy show is always lackluster in that dept. simply because the network that pays for it is unsure of its popularity. DOCTOR WHO, BUFFY, MERLIN, X-FILES...all had pretty lame effects in their first seasons due to budget constraints for shows just out of the gate....but they all got better with successive seasons and larger budgets. I'll be interested to see how ONCE changes if it goes to a 2nd season and where the money will be spent.

To be honest, as long as they keep subverting the basic fairytale tropes and flipping them askew to keep it interesting, I'll keep watching.

Oh and my other "don't miss" show...REVENGE...I honestly thought she'd get revenge on everyone in season 1 and they'd be stymied to come up with non-COUNT OF MONTE CRISTO plotlines in season 2, or that it would become a little stagnant, but it's not even been half a season yet and they have already thrown like 3 or 4 monkey wrenches into the works to distance it away from the core MONTE CRISTO idea...and thus creating an altogether different beast. That is what I feel will make it successful, as each week there is something new to be confused or impressed about. Also, every damn time Henry Czerny is on screen all I can hear in my head is "I can understand that you're very upset, Mr. Hunt." and then of course I hear Tom Cruise growl "Kitritch, you've never SEEN me very upset." BOOM! Am I the only one?

[amphibian]

There's a certain solidity to Carlyle even when he's not being Rumplestiltskin that's genuinely fun to watch. It may be a combination of directorial techniques, the lines and the actor himself, but Mr. Gold is always the center of attention in a scene.

Kathryn is being played by the same actress who was on one of my favorite shows - Royal Pains. I liked her there and like that she's being kept around for a while.

This may be slightly heretical, but I do not like Ginnifer Goodwin. There's not enough there in terms of how she's dealing with her lines, scenes and character for me to actually like her much.

I'm beginning to worry that this is turning into a fairy tales Desperate Housewives. This episode was better, but the series-long problems of making Lana Parillo a one note bitch, shoe-horning characters in where they don't belong (Red Riding Hood, Geppetto, Henry etc.) and the show's lack of a deeper story beyond the unsubtle "break the curse" plot are still there.

Grimm has potential for a better run. We'll see Thursday and Friday if it lives up to that potential.

[QuickTidal]

amphibian, on 06 December 2011 - 12:22 AM, said:

shoe-horning characters in where they don't belong (Red Riding Hood, Geppetto, Henry etc.) and the show's lack of a deeper story beyond the unsubtle "break the curse" plot are still there.

See, I find there is a cleverness to the writers about characters like Red Riding Hood, who historically was known for taking food to her grandmother's house, and they have her working at a diner...bringing food to people (clever), and Gepetto who is more like his original incarnation (not just the Disney one) in that he makes lots of magic items including the wardrobe that could transport things (also clever)..that said, I think they are in there for reasons and we will see them get their own episodes and stories as the series goes on...I juts think we haven't gotten there yet. Only time will tell though.

I'm okay with Henry, since he is our entry into the story...and there are major rumors about who his father might be and I think when we discover that, then Henry's character will change. Again, who knows though.

And yeah, I totally agree about Lana Parillo...they need to up her game or soemthing and twist her story so it is interesting. As it stands she is no different than she was at the beginning of the series. Aside from that episode where she had to kill her father we have been given no further depth for her.

And Emma being the main character kinda bugs me, since as it stands (and again, probably will be until Henry's father shows up) she is only a monkey wrench who has been the catalyst for a few things in Storybrooke, but otherwise is superfluous to the narrative.

So yeah, I love the show, but it certainly has its issues, and I think the finale in the spring will show us whether it has the stones to pull out all the stops or not. I hope it does, but yeah they need to fix a few thins to get it firing on all pistons.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 06 December 2011 - 01:42 PM

[McLovin]

amphibian, on 06 December 2011 - 12:22 AM, said:

This may be slightly heretical, but I do not like Ginnifer Goodwin. There's not enough there in terms of how she's dealing with her lines, scenes and character for me to actually like her much.

So far I don't like her much either. So take comfort that you won't burn at the stake alone.

amphibian, on 06 December 2011 - 12:22 AM, said:

I'm beginning to worry that this is turning into a fairy tales Desperate Housewives. This episode was better, but the series-long problems of making Lana Parillo a one note bitch, shoe-horning characters in where they don't belong (Red Riding Hood, Geppetto, Henry etc.) and the show's lack of a deeper story beyond the unsubtle "break the curse" plot are still there.

I kinda get what you're saying. I will say I think Regina has a bit more dimension than you seem to think. Also the deeper story is coming, because we still really don't know what happened to the Evil Queen's "someone" she lost (presumably it's more than just her dad).

[QuickTidal]

McLovin, on 06 December 2011 - 02:11 PM, said:

Also the deeper story is coming, because we still really don't know what happened to the Evil Queen's "someone" she lost (presumably it's more than just her dad).

That's my guess as well, but I hope they start firing off on that aspect soon, but yeah I bet her "someone" will be a doozy.

Is it possible that her "someone" could actually be Henry's unknown father...but that he had a relationship with Emma?

[Abyss]

amphibian, on 06 December 2011 - 12:22 AM, said:

There's a certain solidity to Carlyle even when he's not being Rumplestiltskin that's genuinely fun to watch. It may be a combination of directorial techniques, the lines and the actor himself, but Mr. Gold is always the center of attention in a scene.

Totally. his Mr. gold scene at theend of the ep was brilliant - i love how we still can't tell whether he's affected by the curse or just royally manipulative.

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Kathryn is being played by the same actress who was on one of my favorite shows - Royal Pains. I liked her there and like that she's being kept around for a while.

I liked the reveal of her identity even if Charming staying with her 'because it's the right thing to do' is irritatingly trite.

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... shoe-horning characters in where they don't belong (Red Riding Hood, Geppetto, Henry etc.)

I dunno... so far they've done a decent job of justifying how people ended up who they are. It's not always brilliant (Grumpy dwarf as the town drunk) but workable.

As an aside, i'm expecting Dr. Sark to turn out to be the Pied Piper or the Big Bad Wolf, and the Sheriff to be the Black Knight.

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and the show's lack of a deeper story beyond the unsubtle "break the curse" plot are still there.

The 'deeper story' seems to be the over time reveal of the fairy tale land back story. Not sure they'll get much deep than that beyond the basic 'break the curse' thing. I admit to being curious to see if they can move even that basic storyline beyond two seasons.

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Grimm has potential for a better run. We'll see Thursday and Friday if it lives up to that potential.

Funny - i'm enjoying Grimm well enough but finding it sliding into a repetitious freak-o-da-week pattern. The bigger storyline is barely Buffy revisitted so far.

QuickTidal, on 06 December 2011 - 01:40 PM, said:

...I'm okay with Henry, since he is our entry into the story...and there are major rumors about who his father might be and I think when we discover that, then Henry's character will change. Again, who knows though.

Good question, especially since Emma met whoever it was outside of Storyville.

Quote

And yeah, I totally agree about Lana Parillo...they need to up her game or soemthing and twist her story so it is interesting. As it stands she is no different than she was at the beginning of the series. Aside from that episode where she had to kill her father we have been given no further depth for her.

I do like the game they're playing of not quite revealing whether she is outside of the curse.

Quote

And Emma being the main character kinda bugs me, since as it stands (and again, probably will be until Henry's father shows up) she is only a monkey wrench who has been the catalyst for a few things in Storybrooke, but otherwise is superfluous to the narrative.

Not entirely, but sometimes. She did go into the mine to rescue Henry and Jiminy, and cut a deal with Gold to save Cinderella.

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... I think the finale in the spring will show us whether it has the stones to pull out all the stops or not. I hope it does, but yeah they need to fix a few thins to get it firing on all pistons.

Very much so.
By example, balls would be to invert the curse so that the characters are stuck with their real world personalities, but shoved back to fantasy land.

QuickTidal, on 06 December 2011 - 03:09 PM, said:

McLovin, on 06 December 2011 - 02:11 PM, said:

Also the deeper story is coming, because we still really don't know what happened to the Evil Queen's "someone" she lost (presumably it's more than just her dad).

That's my guess as well, but I hope they start firing off on that aspect soon, but yeah I bet her "someone" will be a doozy.

Is it possible that her "someone" could actually be Henry's unknown father...but that he had a relationship with Emma?

It's been hinted that Snow White had something to do with Queenie losing whoever it was before she gutted her dad to activate the curse.

[QuickTidal]

I'd like to see the curse broken and the fairytale land and real world interacting on a bigger level with the people from there aware of their pasts, but dealing with it on a "choice" level. I'd like to see the two world colliding and perhaps see more of the outside-storybrooke real world begin to react to the existence of a fairytale reality....It would be an avenue they could take...two worlds co-existing FRINGE-style.

[Abyss]

QuickTidal, on 06 December 2011 - 03:47 PM, said:

I'd like to see the curse broken and the fairytale land and real world interacting on a bigger level ...

We don't actually know if storyland still exists. The curse may have nuked it.

[QuickTidal]

Abyss, on 06 December 2011 - 04:43 PM, said:

QuickTidal, on 06 December 2011 - 03:47 PM, said:

I'd like to see the curse broken and the fairytale land and real world interacting on a bigger level ...

We don't actually know if storyland still exists. The curse may have nuked it.

Oh totally...

or conversely...what if it still exists...and is even populated by survivors...or even...duplicate's of the real world folks...There are a number of ways they could spin it, since we don't know what happened.

I'm also wondering when Snow's sister Rose Red will show up.

[Abyss]

From this...

QuickTidal, on 05 December 2011 - 02:22 PM, said:

Oh, and Bill Willingham (creator of the amazing comic series FABLES) has posted an interview he did with himself about the similarities between FABLES and ONCE...and is very open about what went down and how to view the similarities.

http://www.comicbook...rticle&id=35737 ...

I ganked this...

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. I want to know what the evil queen is up to. Why did she craft a curse that imprisons everyone in the future, but leaves them unaware of their punishment? And what value is it to her, if she has to stay in town with them, working her ass off to keep them contained? So far, it seems more of a punishment to her than to them. This makes me suspect many things. One possibility is that she somehow fell victim to her own curse, and the show's other villain, Rumplestiltskin, is the one playing the more complex and manipulative game. Who knows?

'

Which goes interestingly to this...

Abyss, on 06 December 2011 - 03:22 PM, said:

amphibian, on 06 December 2011 - 12:22 AM, said:

And yeah, I totally agree about Lana Parillo...they need to up her game or soemthing and twist her story so it is interesting. As it stands she is no different than she was at the beginning of the series. Aside from that episode where she had to kill her father we have been given no further depth for her.

I do like the game they're playing of not quite revealing whether she is outside of the curse...